I am a Pro-Life Catholic – and I could never ever support Obama – he will destroy America and with him in power infancide and gereatricide will become law.  He is not just pro all abortions, he has no problem killing them after they are born, and he will go after the elderly amongst us after that.

I am in utter disbelief of this article.  WWJD?  Jesus protected those that need protection.  More babies are aborted a day than American’s have died in Iraq to date.  Think on that, then think about how at every chance Obama has voted to extend the rights of murdering mothers to kill unborn babies.  You know that babies who are aborted unsuccessfully and survive have less rights than murdering rapists under Obama.  But then again America is like a big dumb kid with a shiny new toy.  We really should educate our citizens better so we can tell when someone was lying to us or just not let the media spin the information we are given.

I think the fact that the debate moderators avoid such important issues is a big reason that this is not on voters’ minds, and particularly the young uncommitted voters.

We need another confrontation like Saddleback Challenge where real issues were discussed first by one candidate and then by the other.  McCain’s clarity and honesty really trounced Obama there.

Perhaps Mr. Tapper feels he can support Obama because Obama is a “christian”. I can call myself a harvard law review editor, but that does not make me one when I am, in fact, a high school educated middle class homemaker. Your actions speak for your beliefs, no matter what you profess.
I think Mr. Tapper has sold out to the news media and, perhaps, liberal Catholic church if he believes that we have lost the abortion issue. If we elect Obama we may continue to have abortions for another 50years “safe, legal and rare (ha)”. I would hate to have to explain to my Lord why I did not do everything I could to stop it.
Another thing the news media does not tell you is that abortion among black women is going up while abortion among white women is declining. Does this mean that Obama supports genocide of the black race…seeing as he is white american/Kenyan and not African American?

RE:  Cafardi’s comment that anti-abortion activists – - “have lost the abortion battle—permanently. A vote for Sen. John McCain does not guarantee the end of abortion in America. Not even close.”

I believe Cafardi is correct.  In no year since 1973 has public opinion supporting Roe vs. Wade ever been less than 63%.  Even Barry Goldwater accepted Roe vs. Wade in accordance with the original Supreme Court decision.

This issue may be a state’s rights issue – - but it is most surely more a woman’s issue and an issue most grounded in individual decision-making based on one’s PERSONAL values, ethics, morality and faith/religion.

I was a high schooler and college student WAY before Roe vs. Wade – - at a time when abortion was prohibited – - and, yet, abortions were commonly and readily available (and cheaply enough) for anyone wishing to go that route.  Some were done surreptitiously by doctors – - some by nursing and other healtcare-related professionals – - and some by “amateurs” looking to make a quick buck.  With ‘quality’ being an issue – - there was also permanent injury and even death when the procedure was available only on the ‘black market’.

As with illicit drugs – - which are readily available EVERYWHERE at ANY TIME – - abortions, even if made illegal – - would continue to be readily available everywhere and at any time.

The same would be true if guns were outlawed.  They would still be readily available – - as was liquor during Prohibition.

It certainly pays for religious and other interested groups to preach and teach an anti-abortion message and do everything in their power to reduce abortion – - but, as with guns, it’s just a waste of time, money and resources trying to make these prime political issues when there are real pratical problems to be solved.

As it was with Prohibition, it is extremely difficult to legislate (and enforce) morality.

Personally, I believe in prayer in public schools, that the ten commandments should be posted in every courtroom, that this is first-and-foremost a Christian nation, that school vouchers should be available for those choosing to attend religious schools – - and that religious precepts should be more visible in all areas of public life – - and that the ACLU as currently constituted should probably be disbanded – - but I also believe the abortion issue (and any religion-rooted issue) should NOT be a political issue – - nor should either side of the issue be a cornerstone to a major political party’s agenda.

On a national scale, politicizing abortion, guns, and religious issues becomes far too divisive – - thereby diminishing the efficacy of the political process which is so necessary to solving the day-to-day and sometimes calamitous secular problems which continuously confront the federal government.

The Catholic Church is quite clear about its anti-abortion stand.  Members don’t get to choose and need to consult with their Priests and Bishops for correction.  Those who quote these ‘Catholics in error’ either don’t understand the Church or seek to seed confusion.  To spell it out once again:  abortion is murder, a crime against the helpless, a crime against the mother and a crime against society. Abortion is a grevious sin.

Millions of Nazis shouting “seig heil” did not make the Nazi atrocities right.  Millions of selfish self-appointed religious experts don’t make abortion any less heinous an act.

dennisk,

<<<<<Millions of Nazis shouting “seig heil” did not make the Nazi atrocities right. >>>>>

Absolutely.

When my daughter was a teenager, I had a pro abortion friend.  Actually, I think he was a democrat because he had political aspirations and had to argue their line.

He asked me once what would I do if my daughter got pregnant before marriage.

I told him I really couldn’t say, but

I know the right thing to do

I know what I hope I would do

I know what I think I would do.

But if I made the wrong choice all the pro-abortion people in the world saying it was right would not make it so.

Abortions were available, in hospitals by good doctors.  It was reported as a D &C;.  If someone went the other route, it was by choice.

There are really other avenues for those
inconveniences, more so back then.

I was the most naive, sheltered, and anything but affluent person on the planet, and I could have gotten one.

<<<<<<<It certainly pays for religious and other interested groups to preach and teach an anti-abortion message and do everything in their power to reduce abortion >>>>>>>>>

It pays just as well for the pro-abortion crowd. That is the reason nothing will be done.  It is a great cash cow for both sides of the one party.  All they have to do is utter the words, ‘overturn Roe v. Wade, and the checkbooks slap the tabletops and both sides of the issue gets checks.

That’s where we went wrong – it was made a political issue.  It isn’t, it’s a legal issue.

That’s the way these lawmakers get by with doing everything they do, they put it in political terms.  It’s always a democratic issue or a republican issue.  That way they can be sure that half the country will be for it and the other half against – with little real thought to the issue.

The idea that it is a woman’s issue to destroy a child she is carrying, is a slippery slope we have already seen with the partial birth issue, and the refusal to save those aborted alive.

I have read in England, killing a baby under the age of one is not considered all that heinous.  They believe the baby is not totally separated from the mother yet, and that a mother of a child under one year is not yet in her right mind.

Is that next for us?

IF we are going to put abortion in the realm of one’s own personal values, faith and ethics, we are opening up a real can of worms.

Female mutitalion is OK according to somes, values, faith and ethics – actually it’s mandatory in some circles.  So is sex with children, child labor, polygamy, human sacrifices,  revenge killings, burning the widow – I mean we could go on and on under the idea of personal values, ethics, and faith.

Abortion would be available everywhere – and I’m not sure we will ever get that bug back in Pandora’s box – but we could certainly try to curtail it.  It is not only legal now, it is encouraged.  IT is considered the only answer to an inconvenient pregnancy.

By making it legal, it has put a stamp of approval on it, and I think made more feel it is OK.  It has also made all of us, who truly believe it is the killing of an innocent baby, a part of the act.  It’s kinda like the Agatha Christie novel where everyone took a turn at stabbing the man so everyone would be guilty.

There really are two victims in an abortion – the mother and the child.  I do not believe for a moment a woman walks away from an abortion with no emotionally or physical scars.

We probably can’t stop it, but we can provide alternatives, we can also stop encouraging it, and we should be telling women all the facts – about possible physical and emotional problems.

Re: Ladytexan, Post #8;

I don’t believe abortion should be made a partisan political football.  And, like everything else, one way or another, legal or illegal, someone will always be making money off of it.

But, I believe a truth about law is similar to a truth about art – - both REFLECT the society, the culture, and the system of social and cultural values and mores within which they exist.

Consequently, maybe like teaching the dangers of smoking (legal, but also lethal), I think the best way to deal with the abortion issue is to try to turn society and the culture against it – - probably, primarily, through faith-based teachings – - in the hope that society will willingly come to accept an anti-abortion position – - which will result in a change of the law.

It makes no sense to keep politicizing it – - and it’s stupid to have it appear that ONLY Republicans are against abortion – - and only Democrats are for it!  The issue has nothing to do with political philosophy.

TK,

We agree – except I was talking about the politicians making money off the political question.

They both do, and that’s why nothing will ever change – they like it just the way it is.  Perhaps if it changed back, it would be the same, now that it is out of the box.  The point I’m making is both sides like the controversy, they make money.  It will never be decided for good.  They have no interest in the child or the mother.

I’m thinking maybe President Bush has only said one thing with which I could agree.  He said Roe v. Wade would never change until we change the hearts and minds of the people.  That’s where the problem is.

Christians today put more faith in politicians than they do God. 

I would not fight for prayer in school, as I think prayer is a personal thing.  When that decision came down, if the people of the Church had looked to God and trusted in God rather than allowing themselves to be sucked into politics, we would be better off.

No one can tell you that you can’t pray.  No one can tell you where and when you can pray.  If that had been driven home to our children, there would have been no need for getting in bed with corrupt politicians.

With abortion, rather than putting the time, money and focus on trying to give another alternative and truly helping women, they are paying their money to politicians.

JUDAS WAS AN APOSTLE TOO. BUT NOT A VERY GOOD ONE.
YOU CANNOT BE BE PRO LIFE CATHOLIC AND VOTE FOR THE PARTY OF DEATH. HIS HOLINESS THE POPE HAS DEFINED THE DEMONCRATS AS THE NEW NAZIS. GET YOURSELF A PONTIUS PILATE FINGERBOWL. ARE YOU GOING TO STAND BEFORE THE ALMIGHTY AND TELL HIM YOU VOTED IN GOOD CONSCIENCE FOR A BABY KILLER?
DO YOU REALIZE IN HEAVEN YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO A BABY KILLING ATTORNEY? DRESS IT UP ANYWAY YOU WANT AND TELL IT TO JR AS HE LOOKS UP AT YOU FROM THE BUCKET. SHAME ON YOU LUCIFER THE GRADUATE. WE DON’T BUY LIES OR BROWN TOOTHPASTE.

YOU CAN’T BE PRO-CHOICE AND BE CATHOLIC! YOU CAN’T VOTE FOR SOMEONE PRO-CHOICE AND BE CATHOLIC! ENOUGH SAID! ANYONE WHO THINKS DIFFERENT IS DEAD WRONG. REFER TO Archbishop Charles J. Chaput for proof.

A Catholic accepts the doctrines of the Church, one of which prohibits the killing of unborn children.  A person can not vote for a candidate who advocates abortion and still be a Catholic, unless he chooses to be a “cafeteria” Catholic. In that way he can pick and choose which doctrines he will accept.  A cafeteria Catholic is not a true Catholic, but a Catholic in name only. 
Over forty years ago I chose life over abortion and my daughter has proven many times over that I and my wife made the right choice. 
Choose right to life and let God handle the rest.

Anybody that votes for or against a political candidate based simply and ENTIRELY on the SINGULAR issue of that particular candidate’s stand on abortion – - is a nut.

Example (and there are many more): “Papa Doc” Duvalier was a former dictatorial head of state of Haiti – - “re-elected” many times.  In every respect, he was as bad as Saddam Hussein or, maybe, even Stalin.  He was responsible for much torture and many deaths for political reasons.

BUT – - he was, as are most Hatians, a staunch Catholic, he politically favored the Church, and he was a staunch anti-abortionist – - along with being one of the most brutal of modern day dictators.  Haiti remains mired in poverty and is one of the poorest nations on earth today – - probably worsened by his years in office.

BUT – - a ‘real’ Catholic should have voted for Duvalier (or any politician like him) simply because he was ‘anti-abortion’ – - and maybe the more desirable political opposition wasn’t?  Ridiculous.

Would anyone entrust the leadership of this country and its 310,000,000 people to somebody like Sarah Palin – - simply and entirely because she’s ‘anti-abortion’?  Ridiculous.

As Bush II said, for the last 35 years, the majority of Americans (most of the time, 2 to 1), to one degree or another, have accepted Roe vs. Wade – - and that will only change “by changing the hearts and minds of the people”.

Abortion should not be a politicized issue and those making political choices should not do so solely based on any candidate’s stance on the particular issue.  In this country, historically, there is clearly a difference to be maintained between the conduct of secular politics and government – - and organized religion and its dictates and issues.

Many of us strive towards an ideal; few of us are, in fact, ideal.  If all Catholics were ‘perfect’ – - there wouldn’t be any ‘Confession’.  There are many ‘strong believers’ – - but few ‘perfect practitioners’.  And that’s true in ALL religions.

As someone else here said, today, our politics and politicians (good or bad) exist for and live on on “division” (or partisanship) – - divisiveness among the masses – - the divide and conquer concept.  Abortion is one of those issues they count on to keep the divisiveness (and their livelihoods) going!

Pope and President are two entirely different things – - existing in two entirely different worlds.  The standards used for choosing each and the functions each performs have nothing whatsoever to do with each other.

Our Saviour did not come to Earth to say, once we outlaw abortion all will be saved and nothing else needs to be done.  Our Christ whom the father sent to save us all from the gates of fire, came with a message of peace and love.  Jesus said love one another as I have loved you.  He did not say tax the poor, and give the rich tax breaks.  He did not say allow thousands to go homeless while wall street profits.  Abortion is a choice made by ONE person.  It is easy to stand up and say “I am against abortion, Therefore I can tell you bad thing about Obama.”  It is hard to look at the greater issuse and ALL the commandments of our Lord. To say that Obama will “Destroy America” is an evil judgement.  WWJD?  He would help the poor, take care of the sick, love those who are not loved…  Look to the saints.  Yes abortion is a sin, but so is the Killing all other innocent!

BLOW IT OUT GABRIEL’S HORN. THE CEMETERIES ARE FULL OF FAKE DO GOODERS . GIVE YOURSELF TWO KUMBAYAS. CHILD MURDER IS NOT BLOWING YOUR NOSE IN A TISSUE. THE PARTY OF DEATH IS SPELLED OBAMACRAT. YOU MY FRIEND ARE EITHER THE JUDAS GOAT OR THE LEG OF LAMB. ONE NATION UNDER GOD THREE UNDER JOHN MCCAIN. BLESSED ARE THE GUN BEARERS FOR THEY SHALL SEE FREEDOM.

http://WWW.BLOGTALKRADIO.COM
SOAP

http://WWW.SPIRITOFAMERICAPARTYBOOK.COM

BLESSED TOM – this is not a hate site – you have to go to your Daily Kos site to talk all the hate you want.  Besides you liberals keep thinking you can brand us as haters because we are Conservative when you spout what you did on a right leaning site.  Even a ten cent idiot knows that what you just said was said by a slimy liberal to brand a Conservative leaning site.

Go back to Daily Kos where haters like you belong.

Jesus had some pretty pointed comments about hurting ‘the least of these’ – something about a millstone and a lake——

I don’t think Jesus said people should petition the government to take, by intimidation, the pay for one’s labor and give it to others.

He said we, meaning his people, should care for the widows and orphans.  It’s the duty of the Christians to care for those who can’t care for themselves – not the government’s.

It isn’t the duty for anyone to put in place a system that allows people to make taking welfare a way of life – for generations.

Jesus said a lot of things – I like to hear people talk about Jesus preaching forgiveness, etc., – I just wish they would talk of his other preachings as well.  He said a lot of great things – let’s talk about all of them.

Obama will do exactly like any other politician.  He will do what those who pay him big money, want him to do.

Anyone who thinks the Dem actually champion welfare for the sake of poor people is delusional. 

Who gets the most from programs like food stamps?  The poor?  Get real.  A lot of money is taken from working people.  It goes through quite a few hands, each taking a little off the top – that’s the government people.  The retail grocers, the food processors, big agribussiness get’s a big hunk of the money.  It was never designed to help poor people.

Same with healthcare.  Who will make the money?  Big healthcare corporations, bit pharmaceuticals – and insurance companies – if it’s handled that way.

Housing – well, we only need to remember the 700B – and counting – the fat cats are going to get.

The Republicans do no better with their programs either.

It appears even the catholics can’t hold their nose and vote for mcBain.

What has been forgotten in all the hurt feelers and fetal injustice is that the issue is completely UNCONSTITUTIONAL and should be left for the STATES to decide. Too much government in daily life is tyranny and should be abhorred despite their “good” intentions. Reagan once said the most frightening thing one could hear is, “I’m from the government and I’m here to help.”