So where was the media, several months ago!

They were too busy praising the administration instead of doing their jobs!

The lack of a critical eye by the press is tantamount to asking the question do we have real freedom of the press or an extension of the White House press staff?

Incorrect Assumption, You assume I am a Republican.
Second mistake - There is no such thing as a “public works job” that is code for “Take money from the successful (thru taxes) and give it to the less successful.

This of course never works because the “public works” jobs only exist as long as taxes flow from the successful to the less successful. I am always amazed at how basic fundamentals of economics are missed by so many.

Economics are not a “Right or Left” issue, it is a money issue.  Of course I would tend to agree with you on the Wall Street bailouts they should have been allowed to fail. However your assumption that this is a Republican motivated giveaway is misplaced.

It is a Washington, power give away I think we could agree on.  When you look at the giveaways going on with the current titans of Washington politics you will see that both parties don’t get it.

I think it’s a terrible shame that ALL men and women who run for any type of govt office are not required to have a degree in Economics !

From the article:

“Vice President Biden acknowledged today that the administration underestimated the depth of the economic recession months ago as it prepared a recovery package that is only now beginning to take effect.”

They had well over a year to look at this, then after then the tine after he was inaugurated.

Plain and simple, he got it wrong, and caused obamageddon, one NEVER raises taxes in a recession (a.k.a. Jimmy Carter). Regan pulled us out of that one, and Bush 43 pulled us out of Clinton’s recession.

Government must stay out of the private sector, the auto companies should have been let to file Chapter 11 for restructure, not using the bail out money to buy private stocks, then convert them to common shares, which gives them ownership in these companies who got bail outs.

At least when Bush bailed out AIG and others, there were required payment options. Therefore it was a loan, just as with Chrysler when Lee Iacocca saved the company and paid the government back in record time.

You cannot tax the hell out of a large company and expect them to stay here, such as almost tripling the Capital Gains tax, and Tax Cheat Geitner limiting what they can be paid, even Clinton didn’t do that, he knew just as Reagan, Bush 41, and Bush 43 how to run a business. Now obama is wondering why big businesses are moving off shore, the very same reason 7,800 small businesses have closed.

Not to mention you do not need 32 czars who answer ONLY to obama, not either House. Half the czars and his administration are former ACORN employees, and I am not speaking of Project Vote, I am talking about CCI and other arms which control Billions of dollars that are very difficult to trace.

The man is not stupid, he knows exactly what he is doing, and the goal is a fascist state. If Cap and Trade and Universal Health Care passes, he wins, we lose. Economists have stated that if Cap and Trade passes, it will be the largest tax implemented in the history of the USA.

Post 8

James, good luck in getting a comprehensive conversation with tk, disagree with him too much and he will resort to calling you names, and try to impugn your integrity.

He started doing that with me for the past eight months, among other posters. Which he will most likely start with me again for this post.

Re: Post 7;

“... Regan pulled us out of that one, and Bush 43 pulled us out of Clinton’s recession ...”

And, to this date, Reagan and Bush 43 added more to the national debt that any other presidents in history.  Reagan added an amount nearly equal to the total cost of WW II - and Bush 43 doubled that amount.

What you are ideologically calling “Obamageddon” is primarily the accumulated result of “Reaganomics” and Bush 43’s most-ridiculous-economic-policy of “Cut Taxes And Increase Spending”.

And, up until this week, your simple-minded mantra was that Obama was “a Marxist”.  Now, in a new month, you’re suddenly certain he’s “a Fascist”.  Do you even know the difference?  I’d bet not.

When do you start complaining about the color socks the guy wears?

Re: Posts 9 and 10;

“Peat” and “Repeat” would be traditional.

But, you paragons of discourse have at least temporarily gotten me all wrapped up in hockey jargon - so - for now - I’ll stick with Mr. Empty Net and Mr. Wash Out.

Dear Mr. Empty Net and Mr. Wash Out:

You two started with the namecalling (usually some derogation of Democrat and/or Liberal and/or Obama-ite) and personal attack style posts (and Mr. Empty Net has become obsessive/compulsive about it in innumerable impossibly tedious, rambling and babbling posts) - actually, Mr. Wash Out simply started dittoing Mr. Empty Net - and, as I’ve said before - I hate the no-real-ammunition-left tactic and think it’s middle-school-minded - BUT - I do believe in “an eye for an eye” - so - poke my eye and I’ll poke back!

On the other hand, play nice and I’ll play nice.  So - your choice!

Re: Post 14;

I realize you’re incredibly slow, yet still bicker-prone and argumentative even when you’re totally off-the-wall - - but THE FACTS of the matter - - which, like countless other things for your benefit - - have been repeated over-and-over again because of your, shall we say, various “challenges”:

National debt on Carter’s last day was about $800 billion;

Reagan increased that national debt by some $2.4 TRILLION (an amount almost equivalent to the cost of WW II) - bringing the debt up to some $3.2 trillion.

Bush 41 added some $1.4 trillion - bringing the debt up to some $4.6 trillion.

Clinton had budget surpluses in four of his eight years in office - made payments on the national debt - and left Bush 43 some $300 billion in surplus cash - BUT - in his eight years, overall, he did add some $500 billion to the national debt - bringing the national debt up to some $5.1 trillion.

However, like Reagan, GEORGE W. BUSH increased the national debt in record-breaking manner: Bush 43, single-handedly, added some $6.5 TRILLION directly to the national debt - bringing it up to about $11.6 TRILLION - NOT COUNTING the estimated additional $2.5 TRILLION it will cost to conclude Iraq and Afghanistan and cover the costs of 30,000 wounded/injured soldiers - some 17,000 injured critically and likely requiring lifelong medical care.

Consequently, Bush 43 added some $6.5 TRILLION directly to the national debt (bringing it up to some $11.5, or so, TRILLION) - with another estimated $2.5 TRILLION for Iraq, Afghanistan and military wounded continuing care - which totals some $9 TRILLION ON BUSH 43’s TAB.

Maybe if you start with 1+1=2 ... and work at it real hard for a few years - you’ll eventually be able to get this (???)

And, go poke yourself!  R-E-A-L good!

Re: Post 16;

Do you know the difference between “deficit” and “national debt”?

I never mentioned anything about your alleged “universal health care” bill - and, to my knowledge, no such current bill has been voted on nor even brought up for a vote in the current Congress.

I never mentioned anything about the so-called “Cap and Trade” bill EXCEPT - IF it reduces pollution and promotes alternative energy - I’m definitely for those two outcomes.

If you think so-called “transparency in government” is LESS now than it was during the Bush-Cheney administration - then you’re probably beyond help.

Do you even recognize the difference between “nationalized health care” and a “national health care plan”?  We already have the latter in Medicare and Medicaid; Obama’s proposal is that such a “plan”, similar to the one in existence for government employees, be extended to those NOT on Medicare, Medicaid, or who are government employees’ plan - AT THEIR CHOICE!  At their choice!  Choice.  Get it?

Your post includes a lot of fantasy and comments which are unintelligible to me.

Beyond that - here’s a fact for you: the very stable administrative cost of the existing Medicare health care plan is 3%; the average administrative cost of health care plans managed by private health care insurance providers is - 20%!

Some other facts:

The average health care expenditure per person per year in the U.S. is some $7,500; in France, it’s some $3,600 - and France’s health care system is ranked first among developed countries.  And life expectancy in France is between 5 and 6 years longer than in the U.S.

Medical expense is the leading cause of personal bankruptcy filings in the U.S. - and approximately 80% of those filing DO HAVE INSURANCE (but were apparently “screwed by the fine print”)!

The REAL POINT here is that, like many other things, health care costs in this country have risen out of control - and SOMETHING needs to be done to remedy the situation.

When I graduated from undergraduate school, the average starting pay for college graduates was $12,000 and a still-being-made-now certain “luxury” car model cost $4,000; today, starting pay for college graduates is up about 3.5 times since my graduation - BUT - the cost of that very same luxury car has gone up 11 times! 

The simple problem: over the last 30 years, the growth in income for the average working American HAS NOT KEPT PACE with the increases in desirable or necessary goods and services - ESPECIALLY in anything and everything connected to “health care”. 

And, Wesley, there is no doubt you are the primary “fictionist” here.  In your incessant and partisan denigration of Liberals, Democrats, and, especially, Obama, you regularly present irrelevant fantasies, misconceptions, or your purposeful misrepresentations as “fact” (and, frankly, your extreme ranting and raving about Obama often makes you seem unpatriotic and, sometimes, absolutely unamerican).

Your above post has more than enough examples to prove my points about your fantasies and misrepresentations, whether they are willful or not.

Re: Post 18;

It doesn’t make any sense to you that France’s health care system is generally considered to be the best among all developed countries - that its costs are less than half of the U.S. annual per capita spending - and that Frenchmen live, on average, 5-6 years longer than Americans?

Maybe you just have trouble making sense out of things???

Check it out yourself.

Perhaps the French live longer because they don’t have the racial strife that we have. Theirs is a much more homogeneous population (at least up to now).

Also, you don’t see them getting involved in any armed conflicts the way we do. Remember the old saw about the ad for the French Army rifle for sale—-never fired, and only dropped once.

As far as them having a superior health care system—-I’d want to see some original source documents for that claim!

Re: Post 21;

I’m not an expert on “French racial strife” - but they’ve certainly had their hands full over the last 25-35 years or so with racial strife involving Africans, Muslims, etc.  So-called “riots” there have been more frequent and “more deadly” over that period than they have been here.

AND - check this yourself - France very likely has the MOST UN"homogeneous” population in the entire European Union.  France is very likely the “melting pot” of Western Europe.

The annual number of U.S. “armed conflict” deaths is miniscule compared to the total number of annual deaths in the U.S. - as is the number of annual deaths due to criminal activity.  Their statistical relevance in determining an overall life expectancy is minor.

HOWEVER, just as an example - for the last 30 years - there have been MORE THAN 100,000 DEATHS ANNUALLY in the U.S. due to simple and unnecessary “medical mistakes”!

Since 2001, France has been ranked #1 in the quality and effectiveness of its health care system among the top 50 most-developed nations.  The United States has been variably ranked in that same period between #37 and #44 - YET - among those 50 nations - the U.S. SPENDS THE MOST PER CAPITA, annually, on health care.  (The U.S. spends in the $7,500 per person range; France spends in the $3,600 range - and the UK and Canada spend less than that.)

(It shouldn’t take a lot of effort for you to be able to verify these facts on your own - IF - you make an attempt to use sources other than partisan right-wing propaganda sources.)

Re: Post 24;

See!  There you go again: spinning, bending, misconstruing, misstating, misrepresenting and manufacturing a “fact”.

No where, NO Where, NO WHERE have I made the statement (according to you) that France has “...the fewest deaths per capita than anywhere else ...”

This is just another one of your endless non sequitur goofballnesses.

What I did say was that France has a life expectancy about 5-6 years longer than the U.S.

And I said nothing about “hospital deaths”.

The closest thing I mentioned was that, for many years, the U.S. has had more than 100,000 deaths per year due to simple and unnecessary medical mistakes.

Your, shall we say, “misconstructions”, continue unabated.  Norm Crosby would be proud.

(Thanks for letting us all know that Switzerland shares borders with France and Germany - but you forgot Italy, Austria - and Liechtenstein!)

Note that the hockey puck has yet to document any of his claims regarding the wonderfuul health care system of the French.

The thought of the Obamadonna-Incarnate bringing us down to the level of socialized medicine he seems to want for us (NOT the politicians, mind you)is frightening!

Re: Post 26;

Typical “Wesley In Dallas”.  I happened to briefly mention an apple - and Wesley goes into some kind of a dissertation on oranges!

Here is what seems to be your and your professor’s central point in your post:

“... France came in third in deaths that could have been prevented due to long waiting periods…”

I, on the other hand, have NEVER MENTIONED “LONG WAITING PERIODS”, nor made any comparison whatsoever between France and the U.S. in terms of “long waiting periods”!

The ONLY REMOTELY-RELATED COMMENT I made - which you’ve apparently once again misconstrued - was “... for many years, the U.S. has had more than 100,000 deaths per year due to simple and unnecessary medical mistakes…”.

NOWHERE did I mention ANYTHING to do with “LONG WAITING PERIODS”.

AND - I have no clue as to what ...

“... Prof. Yossi Sheffi, Professor of Civil and Environmental Engineering, Director, MIT Center for Logistics ...”

has to do with French (or American) “HEALTH CARE” ???

Enjoy your oranges.

Re: Post 27;

Hey, Frenchie, if you’re on Medicare (or will be, soon), you’re already on “socialized medicine”; or, if you don’t have two nickels to rub together (or won’t have, soon), you’re already on Medicaid, another version of “socialized medicine”; or, if you’re a government employee being provided with health care services, you’re already on “socialized medicine”; if you’re a Frenchie from Canada by birth, you’re also on “socialized medicine”; and, if you’re an illegal immigrant who freely uses the local emergency room as your personal doctor, you’re already on “socialized medicine”!

And - go and do your own “documentation”!  Do you have to be fed EVERYTHING on a silver spoon?  Can’t you do ANYTHING for yourself?

Re: Post 32;

First, my Post 31, regarding “doing one’s own documentation”, a “silver spoon” and “doing something for yourself” was directed to Post 27, ostensibly posted by one “C. Roy”. 

Why are YOU responding to my post to “C. Roy”?

Are YOU “C. Roy”, too?

Second, it is absurd to pretend a Civil and Environmental Engineer is also some kind of an automatic expert on health care issues.

Third, deaths due to “unnecessary medical mistakes” and deaths due to “a long waiting period” ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.  I mentioned ONLY the former.

Buzz off.

Post 33: For the same reason you attack my posts intended for other people, Pot…Kettle…Black.

tk, and what do the French have to do with the story above regarding Biden? This story became off topic on Post #11, we are now at Post #35…Why do you do that on EVERY single thread?

If Cap and Trade (of course no one knows what that term means) it should be called what it is, the largest tax hike in history…should it pass the Senate, and Universal Health care, I do not want to hear you whining when you can no longer make ends meet, or if you get a serious illness (God forbid), and die due to the fact that you will have to wait months to see a specialist.

Since we are still off topic, it is my hope Sotomayor gets Borked, while on camera, she said Judges should have the ability to legislate from the Bench. The last thing this country needs someone who is a latina racist.

Especially since eight of her last ten 2nd Court of Appeals have been reversed by the Supreme Court. And on the Ricci case, she did not even bother to explain her dissent, she only wrote a single short paragraph. She rebuked blacks as less intelligent in her decision by stating the Firefighters test had a written section, thus it being unfair to blacks.

I could care less what race a judge is, as long as they follow the Constitution to the letter of the law, and judge without prejudice. I would prefer to see the Constitution scrubbed in the name of fairness, and rid it from laws passed over the years due to political preference, the Supreme Court is not a political body, and never should be again. And disband the ACLU as being partisan, I have submitted valid claims to them just to see if they would take my civil rights into consideration, every time they have said something such as, “Your request is not in the best interest of our purview”.

Re: Post 35;

If you want to erroneously call the PROPOSED (but certainly not finalized) Cap and Trade legislation “the biggest tax hike in history” - be my guest.

If the proposed (but certainly not finalized)  “Universal” health care legislation is passed, it will allow me the CHOICE of enrolling in it or keeping my current health insurance (and - EVERYBODY dies!)

There is EVERY likelihood that Sotomayor will be confirmed - and VERY LITTLE likelihood that she won’t - so - get used to it.  For SURE, even if she is empathetic to minorities (including her own) - she’s certainly W-A-Y MORE QUALIFIED than was Harriet Miers!  (And, note, Mr. Expert, she DID NOT DISSENT on the Ricci case - she AGREED with the other two judges on the panel.)

And your statement: “... I could care less what race a judge is, as long as they follow the Constitution to the letter of the law ...”

As usual, you don’t know what you’re talking about.  “The Constitution” and “the letter of the law” are two entirely different things.  The body of the law, i.e., your “letter of the law” reference, is actually contained in state and federal statutes and statutory regulations, and the non-conformance with those statutes and statutory regulations are what the vast majority of judges deal with on a daily basis - and these statutes and regulations are generally fairly specific in their declarations.

The Constitution, the interpretation of which is often the primary responsibility of the U.S. Supreme Court, is a document written in very general terms and is, consequently, open to interpretation - either ‘strict’ or ‘broad’ - or, as is usually the case, somewhere in between.  The Constitution ENABLES the law and statutes and statutory regulations CODIFY it.

Like “C. Roy”, you NEVER have a constructive, productive, or positive thing to say - nor do you EVER suggest any workable alternatives.  All you do is incessantly rag on and babble on about anything and everything you perceive to be even remotely connected to your ideas (often wrong) of “liberal”, “Democratic” or “Obama”.

IIf you can’t define the difference between “liable” and “libel” - why should anyone believe that you know the difference between “liberal” and “conservative”?)

Cap and Trade, continued: Ever since Al Gore started on his incorrect quest for Global Warming, he personally has had has increased his wealth by an astounding 5,000%. Therefore obama’s interest in Cap and Trade is nothing more than money to the Government, which will pay for his Health Care Program, and oh so much more. But what people do not yet realize is, it will come out of their pockets in so many ways.

Cap-and-trade, it’s easy. The feds tell heavy industry what they can spew into the air. If a company goes over the emission amount, they must buy so-called carbon offsets from another company. So the companies that keep emissions low make money, and the companies that spew lots of gunk make less money. Of course, the gunk companies will pass their higher costs on to us, but hey, no program is perfect, right?

Now, less gunk in the air is good. A cleaner planet means better health for all of us. But already, India, China, Mexico and other countries have told President Obama they will not limit emissions. They don’t really care about global warming. So even if we cap-and-trade all day long, the Earth will continue to be dirty.

The Congressional Budget Office recently estimated that the resulting increases in consumer prices - slightly less than the Waxman-Markey target - would raise the cost of living of a typical household by $1,600.00 a year. Some expert studies estimate that the cost to households could be substantially higher, up to $3,100.00. The future cost to the typical household would rise significantly as the government reduces the total allowable amount of Co2.

Americans should ask themselves whether this annual tax of $1,600.00-to $3,100.00 per family is justified by the very small resulting decline in global Co2. Since the U.S. share of global Co2 production is now less than 15 percent (and is projected to decline as China and other developing nations grow), a 15 percent fall in U.S. Co2 output would lower global Co2 output by less than 4 percent. Its impact on global warming would be virtually unnoticeable.

The proposed cap-and-trade system would be a costly policy that would penalize Americans with little effect on global warming. The proposal to give away most of the permits only makes a bad idea worse. Taxpayers and legislators should keep these things in mind before enacting any cap-and-trade system.

Several Independent Foundations have done an analysis of how this bill would affect our economy. From now till 2035 might sound like a long way off…but a child you have today will only be around 26 years ago and just starting to raise a family when that time comes. Here are their findings. The “environmental” bill would:
•Reduce aggregate gross domestic product (GDP) by $9.6 trillion
•Destroy 1,105,000 jobs on average, with peak years seeing unemployment rise by over 2,479,000 jobs
•Raise electricity rates 90 percent after adjusting for inflation
•Raise inflation-adjusted gasoline prices by 74 percent
•Raise residential natural gas prices by 55 percent
•Raise an average family’s annual energy bill by $1,600.00 up to 3,100.00
•Increase inflation-adjusted federal debt by 26 percent, or $29,150 additional federal debt per person

I will guarantee you, folks, that the government already has plans to make sure that low-income Americans will not pay a dime in increased energy costs. This will be just another notch on the entitlement belt.

Speaking of scams…don’t let the government fool you into thinking that ethanol is going to solve all of our problems either. Not only is it worse for our environment but it is going to cost you money. When that ragtag band of tired socialists and communists ran for the hills with the fall of the Soviet Union they immediately started looking for a new vehicle they could use for their anti-capitalist agenda. They found it. The environment. And they’re so happy that you are so easily conned.

Sources:
The Washington Times
The Economist Monthly
Several Studies done by acclaimed Economist and Environmentalists

I did the research, read everything I could find from the sources, therefore using their facts to put this together, this effort was over several days…also see below:

***There is a new slogan for this Administration: “Don’t feed the Hand that Bites you.”

Re: Post 38, 39 and 40;

“Chicken Little”?  You’re it, man!  “The sky is falling, the sky is falling!!!”  That’s you mantra!

With regard to your interminable babbling (among other things) about a potential national health plan or your ranting and raving about potential ‘cap and trade’ legislation - do you realize there are NO FINALIZED VERSIONS of either proposal?

To begin, PROPOSED legislation must be originated and/or developed in both the House and the Senate.  Then, if each body is interested in pursuing such legislation, the leadership of each chamber will submit the proposal to each chamber’s appropriate committee (including members from BOTH parties) to review, accept, reject, modify, re-write, amend, etc., the proposal.

The committee decides if it will then actually submit the almost always-modified and amended proposal to its respective general memberships for consideration, review, debate, further amending, etc. 

At that point, the general membership of both the House and the Senate may further review and debate specific provisions of the proposed legislation and decide if they wish to proceed with the matter or not. If they decide to proceed, the proposed legislation will again, almost undoubtedly, be modified, re-written, re-configured, amended, etc.

Then, assuming both chambers of Congress agree to move forward with the then usually oft- and significantly-modified proposals - BOTH chambers will submit their respective versions to a joint committee whose purpose is to compromise and/or reconcile any differences in the bills that emanated from each chamber.  Obviously, there will be further changes made here.

Assuming this is accomplished (as opposed to the proposal being sent back to each chamber for further compromise and/or modification), a “final” version of the legislation would be generated and re-submitted to both the House and the Senate to be voted upon by each’s general membership - and if it is approved as written by both chambers - it will become statutory, a law.

The proposed ‘national health care plan’ and ‘cap and trade legislation’ are only in the beginning phases of this drawn-out process.  According to my information, a ‘national health care plan’, costing $600 billion over 10 years, has just emerged from its Senate committee.  To my knowledge, the House version is still under consideration in its committee.  To my knowledge, the proposed ‘cap and trade legislation’ is not actively being processed at this time.

Instead of all your “sky is falling” yammering - would it not make sense to withhold judgment on both a national health care plan and cap and trade legislation until such time as both issues emerge in their FINAL “PRE-APPROVAL” legislative form - whenever, and if ever, that happens???

And, instead of reflexively “being against everything” - even when your particular “everything” is only imaginary, hallucinatory or fantastical - would the thought EVER occur to you to offer up a workable alternative (that hasn’t already failed - like deregulation of financial services firms and corporate tax incentivization to move operations to foreign countries)???

All you do is bitch and moan and groan - usually about chimeras arising in your own mind - and you NEVER have a single positive alternative to offer .  You are the quintessential, lemming-like and hackish ideological partisan.  Your only modis operandi is to - “Just Say No!” - to EVERYTHING and ANYTHING you perceive has having originated “on the OTHER side” - in this case, Democratic, Liberal, Obama, etc.

I would suggest that you might consider using all your homebound free time to broaden your horizons - NOT narrow them!

And, keep in mind: the last eight years of Bush-Cheney (or was it Cheney-Bush?) administration (with six of those eight years accompanied by a GOP congressional majority) have, by-and-large, been DISASTROUS for this country!  At times, it seems a high school Student Council might have done a better job.  Were you also bitching and moaning and groaning for THOSE eight years?  (I doubt it!)  Obama-Biden and the current Democratic Congress have a L-O-N-G way to go before they get to be as demonstrably incompetent as were Bush-Cheney and their GOP Congress.

You vehemently complain about the mainstream media being biased, i.e., refusing to be objective, accurate, fair and balanced!  Do you have similar self-loathing regarding your own refusal or failure to also be objective, accurate, fair and balanced???

Unbelievable.

WID:  As us liberals well know (but seldom admit),the equal protections of the 14th Amendment do not apply to the “rich”.

    Now, turning to the Communist Manifesto (the liberal Bible)we see that number two on Marx’s ten points was a heavy “progressive” income tax.

    Our beloved Obama-donna Incarnate is moving us that way as quickly as he can. The government knows what is best for us, so keep your mouth shut, pay whatever taxes HE wants you to pay, and do exactly as you’re told.

    Cap-and-tax is going to be just fine. Socialized medicine is going to be just fine. The Supreme Court is going to be just fine.

If you want to see the Health Care Chart, you can see it here:

http://docs.house.gov/gopleader/House-Democrats-Health-Plan.pdf

On another note: The newest Science Czar John Holdren - This man has written many books about population control, and is a strong believer in Eugenics.

This White House may as well be run by the Mafia, at least they have something obama dose not have…A code of Honor.

Here is a list of Obama’s current and prospective Czar positions:

1. Technology Czar: Aneesh Chopra.
2. Drug Czar: Gil Kerlikowske
3. Copyright Czar: Pending.
4. Energy Czar: Carol M. Browner
5. Car Czar: Ed Montgomery.
6. Terrorism/WMD Czar: Gary Samore.
7. Health Care Czar: Nancy-Ann DeParle.
8. Education Czar: Richard Condon.
9. Economic Czar: Paul Volcker.
10. Mortgage Czar: Pending.
11. Urban Affairs/Housing Czar: Adolfo Carrion.
12. Guantanamo closure Czar: Danny Fried.
13. Great lakes Czar: Cameron Davis.
14. Stimulus accountability Czar: Earl Devaney.
15. Cyberspace Czar: Pending.
16. Border Czar: Alan Bersin (Former US attorney).
17. Intelligence Czar: Admiral Dennis Blair.
18. Regulatory Czar: Cass Sunstein.
19. Pay Czar: Kenneth Feinberg
20. Iran Czar: Pending.
21. Tarp Czar: Herb Allison.
22. Middle-East peace Czar: George Mitchell.
23. *Science Czar: John Holdren. *This Czar will change into something else.
24. Green jobs Czar: Van Jones.
25. Afghanistan Czar: Richard Holbrooke.
26. Sudan Czar: J. Scott Gration.
27. Mideast policy Czar: Dennis Ross.
28. Information Czar: Vivek Kundra.
29. AIDS Czar: Jeffrey Crowley.
30. Faith-based Czar: Joshua Dubois.
31. Climate Czar: Todd Stern.
32. Science Czar: John Holdren - This man has written many books about population control, and is a strong believer in Eugenics

Conclusion

Where do we go from here? What does it mean to our fizzling democracy to have more Czars and more centralized power at the executive branch? 

The problem with this picture is that more Czars mean more layers of bureaucracy, more corruption, more control and abuse, as well as more inefficiency and ineptness.

Re: Post 45;

You apparently have an absolute fetish about “Czars”.

The Constitution defines and limits the powers of the Executive Branch of government.  Therefore, regardless of how many “Czars” are appointed in the Executive Branch by the President, their power and authority is constitutionally-limited.  And, remember, Reagan started the whole “Czar” thing.

Your statement: “... This White House may as well be run by the Mafia, at least they have something obama dose (sic) not have…A code of Honor ...”

Ridiculous.

Re: Post 48;

Your statement:

“... See tk, once again…this is why you need to do research on your sources, using more than one ...”

Get off your middle-school self-puffery, Wesley! (And your damned “Czar” fetish!

In reality, the word “czar” (or “tsar”) was first used in American politics in the 1830s and was used by supporters of Andrew Jackson to refer to Jackson’s opponent, banker Nicholas Biddle, who they called “the bank czar”.

The terms was first widely used by journalists in the 1920s to refer to ‘political big wigs’ - and the term was used again in the 30s, during FDR’s presidency - to SPECIFICALLY refer to: INDIVIDUALS CHARGED WITH PUSHING THROUGH INITIATIVES - which is the SAME meaning inferred today inside the obama administration.

Presidentially-speaking, Richard Nixon first used the term to refer to Jerome Jaffe, made the first “drug czar” in 1971; Jaffe’s appointment was followed by that of John Coe and William Simon, who were Nixon’s successive “energy czars”.

The term has continued in use and, even George W. Bush engaged in “czarism”, appointing Gen. Douglas Cote as his “war czar”.

And - this is all irrelevant.

You’re using the term as a form of fear-mongering - AND - you’re playing on the Russian derivation of the word to infer ‘communism’, ‘socialism’, etc.  But, in the real world, no one in the Executive Branch, regardless of title, has any more “power” than the Constitution allows within the scope of the separation of powers among the three brances.

Once again - the term “czar”, as used in connection with appointive positions within the U.S. government, refers to: INDIVIDUALS CHARGED WITH PUSHING THROUGH INITIATIVES.

In other words:

An intramural “expediter”; an inside-the-administration, issue-oriented “ombudsman”; a “liaison”; a “team leader” or “team captain” - and all serve at the discretion of their designated supervisors and/or, ultimately, at the discretion of the president.

The rest of your post, like your fetish about “czars”, is nothing but a collection of partisan irrelevancies.

And, remember - relative to the rest of your tripe:  Reagan doubled the size of government and tripled the national debt - and Bush 43 nearly matched that.  So get off your damned harping on “government expansion” and the “deficit”.  After Reagan and Bush 43, GOPs have no business bitching about DEMs expanding the government or increasing deficits.

(Do you ramble all over the place on purpose, or because you’re easily bored, or because you find it difficult to concentrate, or because you’re just parroting somebody else’s talking points - or what ???)

You’re a tedium - like an ADHD child.

Post 50:

“Once again - the term “czar”, as used in connection with appointive positions within the U.S. government, refers to: INDIVIDUALS CHARGED WITH PUSHING THROUGH INITIATIVES.

In other words:

An intramural “expediter”; an inside-the-administration, issue-oriented “ombudsman”; a “liaison”; a “team leader” or “team captain” - and all serve at the discretion of their designated supervisors and/or, ultimately, at the discretion of the president.
——————————
This many Czars are in direct conflict with other departments, they answer to no one but the president, they are NOT vetted, nor do they need confirmation from either House. This many are used to get the dirty work done. His Cabinet, and both Houses already have these responsibilities, and they do NOT like the Czars over-riding them.

Who are you to tell anyone what to do, I prove my points, and you are unable to even post a link.

Your post is full of lies, those who always attack are masking their own deficiencies.

Post 54:

So, you do not think Government is not spending us into oblivion, why pay the unnecessary extra $5.520 Million a year.

And what does this have to do with WWII, or even Boxers???

C.Roy,

It seems no where I post he continually brings up off-topic comments. It is my opinion he thinks he is intimidating me, but all it does is show a serious compulsion.

Congress is looking into the legality of so many czars, since they are also stepping on their authority, Holdren is one who is an extreme radical who has written many books on Eugenics. One of his first ideas was putting sterilization chemicals in drinking water in selected areas, one of which in the 1970’s included Black neighborhoods.

Of course we will be attacked for our comments…Ask me if I care.

Good for you, lady Welcome to the fray. Now, see if you can get WID to proof-read his posts. His spelling is just a shade short of perfect.

Too many posts to review them all. Actually, your spelling and grammar aren’t any worse than that of the hockey puck.

Nevertheless, be aware with fear and trembling that I’ll be watching your missives like a hawk as we go forth dealing with ignorant, arrogant, cement-headed liberals such as the hockey puck.

This is something everyone in the USA needs to see.

Click this link to see who have signed it, then notice the absence of any democrat:

http://www.letfreedomringusa.com/pledge-to-read

This one is for the Health Care Bill, the next one will be for Cap and Trade, then a push to have all members sign a pledge to read every bill themselves, not their individual staff reading it for them.

When the data is compiled, a commercial will air in every State.

Interesting that the hockey puck presumes to lecture on apostrophes when in the same post he spells the plural of “fellas” with an improper apostrophe, viz, “fella’s”! No end to their arrogance, is there?

BTW, puck, I’d soft-pedal the libel-liable crap until you learn the difference between “whit” and “wit”.

Re: Posts 65 and 66;

Schmucker, you don’t have a whit of wit nor, apparently, anything else going for you.

WIDer, check your own posts if you want to practice your ability to perceive signs of mental disability.

Every Community has a Village Idiot, tk is AIM’s.

What is department do you work in? The Redundancy Department of Redundancy.

Post 70:

re: Paragraph

“Do you notice how you evade the issue and/or change the subject whenever your posts are criticized or your personal idiocies are pointed out?”

I do not respond to your shortcomings, I have not been attacked by anyone but you, which enforces my statement.

Ps. I really liked the way you signed you post #68. 

It is getting so that every time I come here lately in hopes to learn something new, that I find that spelling is the most important issue.  Not only do I feel concerned that I must be careful to spell everything correctly, but that I should probably also be very careful not to end a sentence with a proposition.., errr, I mean preposition! (LOL) Has anyone been scolded for doing that yet ?????  Did I use too many question marks ?  I think I will play it safe and just watch from outside the ring for awhile, and I won’t be placing any bets on tk either !  Have a great week, you guys ! <Smile>

Re: Post 74;

Your statements:

“... As with the Mainstream Media, he refuses to research all sides ...”

Wesley In Dallas personified.

” ... went for the facts using pro and con debate sources ...”

You wouldn’t know a “fact”, a “debate”, or a give-and-take, “pro and “con” discussion even if you tripped over them - and, in your posts, you are a one-sided, partisan, talking-point machine.  A mechanical parrot who has nothing better to do with his time than to incessantly regurgitate right-wing, fly-by-night, propaganda - usually poorly and often incoherently.

” ... to have fair and honest debates ...”

Your own basic dishonesty is evidenced by your insisting, for weeks, that the words “liable” and “libel” are synonyms - simply to evade admitting that you made a stupid mistake in the spelling of “libel” in a childishly argumentative post.

I have no hostility, WIDer.  I offer my opinion - and I often make it a point to criticize the ridiculous partisan blather and blarney that you often try to pass off here as some kind of informed and intellectually-balanced interpretation of real-world facts.  Following that - I simply do as I’m done unto.  Poke me with partisan blather and blarney - and I poke back.  (Example: “... Not to worry, he is a closet liberal ...” or your ridiculous statement ” ...‘My dad can beat up your dad’ sort of deflection of real issues ...”)

P.S.

And for YOU to criticize someone else’s spelling, grammar, context or syntax - you, the original Norm Crosby incoherent clone - is an absurdity!  (Plus - you often sound like a crybaby - as in this Post 74 of yours.)

And tk, one of these days if you ever wake up, I imagine that you are going to be sorely surprised in very big way that you were not paying close attention to the facts; instead of always being so consumed throwing your tantrums over what you CHOOSE to believe, and about what you CHOOSE NOT to believe, and putting everyone down!  Please WAKE UP, MAN, and save yourself !  We are not your enemies here !  I don’t often like a lot of facts which I learn here, or other places either; but there comes a time when you must grow up and face reality! No one is making up stuff to post here to deliberately make you or me angry. And everyone that I have seen post here (except for you) has been willing to state the facts, no matter what they wish were not the truth.  But you never do !  When someone posts some interesting research and states a simple fact that you don’t want to believe,  I have watched you go biserk, and set out to persecute that person by making fun of them for what they chose to share with everyone. You make fun of things sometimes, as if what they are posting is no big deal to you , or that it is not true !  And you are the one who is the cry baby ! 
Perhaps you were one of those children who was told there was no Santa Claus at too early of an age, and you are still angry ???? I don’t know. But I have been wondering why you get so upset with the guys who post things here, no matter what the topic. And so, I can only assume is because you are a closed minded hard headed narcisstic liberal. So if you are joining us here to learn, fine. But if you are joining us here to be a bully, then please stop and go somewhere else because you are interfering with my learning. And stop using the dumbdowned govt text books that you must be using for references.     

I heard something somewhere once, which I think is so true.  To be a liberal under the age of 20 (?) shows that you have a good heart.  But to remain being a liberal after that shows you are just being stoopid !!> It’s Mispelled… I KNOW !! I KNOW !!
Hey, I was a liberal feeling thinking person for awhile (many moons ago) before I began paying close attention to everything and now I am proud to say that I am a conservative. (Thank God !) And I am still learning, which is one of the reasons that I come here to ACI. And we are all always learning, no matter how old we get, because there is always something new to learn. And we all make mistakes now and then! > EVEN YOU !  So would you please stop with the insults and with the name calling and settle down and behave yourself ?!  I wonder if deep down you are a really a common sense thinking conservative who is just screaming to grow up and to break free ???  We can only hope !!

Diane,

Well said and well thought out. The job of our
Media when I was growing up, and taught in High School and College was; every story had two sides, which back in the day they did tell both sides equally, the way it should have always been.

Mainstream Media (MSM) from the Network News (including CNN, and MSNBC), Liberal newspapers such as the NY Times and 98.7% of all large city newspapers are not fair to both sides of any dissent against Obama or his policies, Democrats, activists groups are never reported, thus hundreds of millions in this country only see one side of a story, Obama’s side.

Nielsen Rating Service, who monitors and rates the public on the most watched television shows, also monitor the News Broadcasts. So Nielsen (a largely left leaning org.) released a report on who watches what news shows. Fox News scored #1 of 10 time slots in News Broadcasts, why you may ask? It is due to the fact that Fox gives you both sides, and on many stories they have pundits and many House and Congress members who are liberal to make their point, and the same with Republicans. Therefore you have a Point and Counter Point when a question is asked by the Anchor.

But since Fox does not always follow the MSM in not sharing only one point of view, they are demonized for being fair and objective (with the exception of possibility of Sean Hannity), but many of their Anchors and most field Reporters have come from CBS, NBC, and ABC News. At Fox they are not restricted by the Producers to report only one side. They are the “Real” journalists, and investigative reporting, because the still believe in telling the truth.

Fortunately and something I have not seen in awhile, are 52 fiscally responsible Democrats in Congress, 44 of which this last vote on Cap and Trade crossed over to vote with Republicans, however eight Republicans voted with the Democrats, causing the Bill to move to the Senate by “one” vote.

In the Senate, there are four democrats who are fiscally Conservative.

Re: Post 77;

Dear Dr. Diane:

With all due respect - a completely nutty post.

(And, just so you know, my distaste is for the extreme ideological nutcases at both ends of the spectrum - and those here, like Wesley, who peddle nothing but misinformation, misstatements, misrepresentations, misinterpretations - all intended to justify and “prove” his own narrow-minded extremism.)

You sound like you might be capable of engaging in an intelligent conversation on the issues - so why would you waste you time in a sophomoric and partisan attempt at “psychoanalyzing the opposition”.  Forget attacking the messenger: focus on the message once in a while!

And if you think the world is divided between “liberals” and “conservatives”, then you’ve obviously been taken in by all the Wesleys way out there on the political fringe.  Note: 23% of registered voters are registered as GOPs; 38% of registered voters are registered as DEMs; and 39% of registered voters are registered as Independent, unaffiliated, or third party (third party registrants total 5%) - and, right now, the “liberals” you keep harping on represent the clear majority and hold the presidency and both houses of Congress - so - it’s ridiculous to be doing nothing but whining on-and-on because you can’t accept the fact that “liberals” were the winners.

As for me - I am a nearly life-long registered “Independent” (41 years) - with an additional single four-year stint registered as a Republican (1988-1992).  In terms of politics, I would NEVER join either party since (1.) I am not a joiner by nature; and, (2.) I think both major parties as currently constituted - suck. 

Politically-speaking, I prefer to call myself a “Traditionalist” - and I guarantee that in many, many ways - I am F-A-R more “conservative” than you and many people who post here.  Further, in the past election, I found I could NOT vote for McCain based on his selection of Palin as a running mate (I would have voted for him had he selected Charlie Crist or Colin Powell).  Neither did I vote for Obama; instead, I voted a write-in.)

I am NOT interested in your amateurish (and partisan) “personal advice”.  If you want to babble and blather, address your posts to Wesley - he seems to enjoy such “mindless mothering”.

If you want to do something constructive and reasonable (other than babbling ASSUMPTIONS about another who may have political perspectives different than yours) - why don’t you post extensive contemporary “defintions” here of BOTH “liberalism” and “conservatism” - since I don’t believe most people have anywhere near a true working knowledge of either - yet each continuously bitches about the other.  You might enlighten the unenlightened - and learn something yourself in the process.

Diane:  Contrary to the hockey puck, I believe you made some good points. With time, you’ll learn to ignore this pompous whithead and address the substance of whatever AIM article is under discussion. aya con Dios!

tk,any post…

Voting for someone who you KNOW has no chance of winning is akin to not voting at all, and yes I am aware of other parties, such as Independents, Libertarians, Socialist party and such.

I for one will not waste a vote, I am partisan against “Liberals”, real democrats I often admire, which were renamed in 1990 Blue Dogs by a Conservative Democrat. Which they all were during and before JFK. A Yellow Dog democrat is one who will vote for a democrat even if they believe that person to be bad for the country.

How is it that you read the Health Care Bill, while it is still being debated, and is in constant change in Congress, when they could not get their own party to vote for the first one, and likely will not vote for this one.

I had last nights obama’s speech on DVR, has he lost his ability to explain things which should make sense to anyone. He would talk for 20 minutes on per question asked, yet no one understood what he was saying. Several of the questions were planted, since he was answering while RAEDING from the teleprompter, it was very obvious he was not looking at the reporter most of his answers. He is killing himself for continuing to use the “Blame Bush” theme, which his own economists have told him it is time to take responsibility.

After his first stimulus, CLAIMING that it would cause a recovery by the end of the year. Economists are saying that since he took control of the economy with that stimulus package, the economy now belongs to obama and no one else. Reagan never put the blame on Carter after he was elected, Bush 43 did no blame Clinton for the economy after he took office…Yes I am saying that Clinton did not really have a surplus according to the CBO, and a dramatic economical slide during his last year in office. Clinton hired his own Accounting Firm, and refused to use CBP numbers, which even the MSM agreed with…

And for God’s sake, stop whining. My post to Diane is something she asked for, and received and blames you, as do the rest of us here blame you for going off topic and slamming anyone who disagrees with you, which makes you the Yellow Dog in this argument, whether or not which party you claim to be for.

I believe you are ticked off, since I can back my claims while you are unable to verify yours.

Get real, or get off…your choice.

It’s hard to understand why the average cement-headed liberal would call Palin, who had been elected to two executive offices would be considered “inexperienced”, at the same time bowing to the Big BO, whose work exoerience has been covered up by the “MSM”, and whose senatorial experience consisted primarily of running for president.

IF BO has any executive/administrative background (“neighborhood organizer” -right!), it hasn’t been publicized. BTW, 52.6% majority is an honest win, but hardly signifigant.

BTW has ANYBODY ever released BO’s college or law school grades. Has he ever written anything for his Law Review?

C.Roy Re : (Post #83)  Point well received and thank you ! 

And Re: (Post #87)  In total agreement with you there, also, regarding Palin with all of her great experience; as well as leadership, and accomplishments !  When one reads about all that she has done and what all she accomplished, she is amazing !  And then thee is B.O. (The community organizer).

Hi Diane,

You are another voice of reason and reality. Sarah Palin is now even more popular even after properly resigning her post as Governor of Alaska; her polling is now at 72% Approval.

If you hear the Usurper in Chief’s 11th televised appearance to further push his Health Care Agenda before the August break for Congress. Another lackey in the Senate, Harry Reid declared the Bill dead until the end of the August Break. There is a great debate and a splitting of their own Party, the 52 Conservative Democrats want to know exactly how it will be paid for, but there just is not an answer.

During the very same Prime Time presidential address, the very last question asked was regarding the Black Cambridge Professor, he called the Police action was performed “stupidly”, without knowing a single fact about what had happened, other than the arrest of the professor, in which they let him go after he stopped being belligerent, and showed proof he was the owner of the Home.

A few days earlier, police were called to the same address as two black youths were attempting to break into the Professor’s home.

This time, his next door neighbor saw him using his shoulder to open the rear door to the home, when the police arrived on the scene and demanded to see proof of who he was, be became extremely angry, calling the officers racists and would not shut up long enough to answer their questions, and refused to offer any identity. So he was handcuffed till he settled down enough to show his ID.

All the officers were doing was trying to protect his home, since there had been a previous attempt at a legitimate break-in.

The Sergeant who responded was involved with helping black youths. Obama did eventually apologize to the sergeant and the Police Department, after the Fraternity of Police Officers Union went on television and told the whole story. There has been no apology from the Professor.

The article can be found here:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/07/24/cambridge-police-unit-demands-apology-obama-stupidly-remark

Can you even imagine if any other President had made those remarks before knowing the facts?

Under Obama, the Government is 33% larger than any Government before him, part of that is having 32 Czars who are not required to be vetted by Congress, and answer to no one but Obama. Their job descriptions are already covered by other appointees and departments in Congress.

His latest Czar is in favor of Eugenics, and has written many books on the subject. One of the books describes how they can use population control by putting sterilization chemicals in the drinking water.

Never before has a president taken control over Private Companies. Now he is allowing Mortgage Companies to offer Sub-Prime lending, the very same thing that caused the economic collapse.

In just over six months, the CBO has stated obama has spent 5.5 times more than any other President in history, and planning even more.

When Congress and the Senate was taken over by Tax and Spend democrats, are what caused big business to leave the country, now obama has raised the Companies Capital Gains Taxes which has caused most of the rest of big businesses to either move off-shore or close down, and he is now blaming insurance companies for doubling the Health Care Premiums from businesses. He has broken the back of this nation, even making a pact with Russia for Nuke elimination, just as Regan had done in the 1980’s. But Regan found that the Russians only disabled non-working nukes, I am sure that will be the same, since Russia will not allow us to see them being disabled, and promised them he would not build the Nuclear defense system in Poland. That system is extremely accurate, and will destroy a nuke within seconds of a launch. It was meant for North Korea and Iran, now there is nothing to stop them from launching an attack.

Diane,

I like the web site you mention. As for Saul Alinsky, I am very familiar with his works and what he is all about, and it is all bad. We cannot afford for this country to become Socialist or Marxist, which it appears is the direction we are currently heading.

The Framers of the Constitution put in three branches of government so one party could not control all three, but it has now happened. They should have known that could have become a possibility and written laws to prevent it from happening.

tk, is bragging that France has the #1 Health Care system in the world, but they are nowhere close the the cures and drugs which help, are almost every one are made by our own Pharmaceutical Companies. In fact there was big news made last week, a research company has found a way to make adult Stem Cell technology as good if not better than fetal Stem Cells, they are a couple of years away from human testing, but have already used adult stem cells which will repair liver, kidney’s, even a cure for some of the worst untreatable diseases, such as Parkinson’s, promising for AIDs patients, Cancer, MS and others (including everything Fetal Stem Cells are being tested for). If ObamaCare passes, he will force drug companies to lower costs to the point to where they will no longer be able to create and improve life saving drugs.

As I have said before, those who voted for obama for Change, ended up with Chains. Also, the big argument with the new CIA director challenged Pelosi when she claimed the CIA never told her about Light Torture methods, Panetta produced a document with her signature on it, proving she was in the meeting, then called Panetta and called him a liar. Well she lied to Congress, which is a crime which would end her career in politics. This has been (so far swept under the rug), so now they are going after Dick Cheney, after he baited the Justice Department, by telling a truth. That there were plots to target and Kill Osama bin Laden and his right hand man, so Attorney General Eric Holder (not so honest either), is calling for an investigation into Cheney. But the plan was scrapped, then went after him on the battlefield. (Duh…Was that NOT a good plan?)

When the truth comes out, Pelosi will be in hot water, that no one will be able to stop kicking her out of Congress.

Some levity here, when Hillary visited North Korea, they called her a hopeless inept child, and do not want to talk with her again. <Laughing>

Back to ObamaCare:

Doctor Mark Siegel MD, PhD (Former Head of the AMA) in the new ObamaCare Health Scam, found on page 389 of the Bill refers to Mentally Disabled people as “Retarded”. On page 425 of the Bill at age 59, your Health Care would be severely limited, and at age 65 you would be considered Elderly, and would meet with your physician every “five” years to discuss what you want to do should you become very ill. Past the age of 75, would be known as normal old age, no choices here folks.

Everyone would have a “Heath Choices Commissioner” to determine what your Doctor would be allowed to do for medical test and treatments and has the power to deny.

When he talked with Democrats, the Conservative Blue Dog Democrats may never pass this legislation. The term “Retarded” was mentioned by Nancy Pelosi, and was entered into the bill. It was left there in the final Bill intentionally to be found when Republicans set down with Democrats to review the Health Care Bill.

The House Republicans have come up with a way to cover all Americans Health Care as it is now, for low to no premiums to pay. Speaking with the Insurance Companies, and Defense attorneys agree to restrict damages in Health Care law suits. The agreement is due to Insurance Companies will eventually be eliminated, and under Obama’s Health Care, Lawyers will be unable to sue providers and hospitals for any mistakes, and/or cause of death.

As it stands now, only Texas and California are the only two states who have instituted Tort Reform, which has lowered the Premiums Doctors, must pay. The result of this has brought many of the country’s best physicians to these two States.

Obama’s Health Care Plan will eliminate Private Insurers; Patients’ rights to private contract with physicians will be abolished, and will lead to rationing.

It is almost midnight on Sunday night. after work. I cannot BELIEVE everthing that I am listening to when I have the time, and I am becoming more confused than ever ! Doing researh regaring France ‘s health care and throwing it out there ......all that I see here , and other places and doing my best to figure out everything.  I think I have it all pretty much figured out, and then I either read or hear things which sheds more doubt.I just know for certain that what has been happening inside the govt has not been right ...no matter what or who is our President for a very long time. It is not just about B.O.  My memory is like a a big highway within a big city which goes all directions and I pay attention to everything that has happened. I soak it all up and then I go to all resources and I read and learn about every thing that I can…. even from the days of Hitler and Stalin and I look at how BIG govt took control.  I have studied ecomoics. I have an IRA ....purchaseda home, have a college education , have health care.  I moved to a sunshiney state last year and was so hoping to settle down to the American Dream….....and to be able to retire and to travel around awhile, as well as to be able to visit my grandchildren ; and even though I had my reservations about where Bush was leading us, I still wanted so much to believe that he cared. But I do remember him saying towards the last of his time in office:  ” Socialism won’t be such a bad thing !! ”  And then I read about all of the secrecy inside the Federal Reserve “. And I have done my homework about why the Fed Reserve was set up , and what year….etc, etc And I have worn many hats during my life and can remember college professors and the endoctrine ....and as a teacher for years, I have seen what the govt operated schools have expected the teachers to do !  And I KNOW that is all wrong !!  VERY WRONG !!  And I am fed up with all of the sneaky stuff !.......With things that I was not taught ,  as well as with so much ever since that has been left out of history books. I wrote to Sean Hannity last year about children were being forced to write essays regarding how wonderful Obama was .....but nothing in the text books ever mentioend anything about McCain.  I didn’t agree with McCain about everything and I didn’t think that he had the fire in his soul that it took to be our president .....but I did think that Palin had more on the ball that Obama or Biden. Anyway, our govt had not RIGHT to be teaching school kids that Obama was the ONE ! .  And inside those school systems , kids were handed out “Obama” buttons to wear and were scoled it they said, ” My parents are for McCain “.  Anyway, Sean Hannity did a small segment at the end of his show regarding this and warned people that this is what is happening all across America.  And that was the last that I have heard of this.  I woke up to late to realize that this was happening with my own children in their college years, and I am slowly working on helping them to look at both sides, finally !!!  I have been to many meetings and have spoken with some of those blue dog democrats who own farms, and who have private busineses who have been there at those meetings to promote The Fair Tax, and who have voted for HR25 every time it rolls around and they have said that this is the only answer ..to get people educated about this in order to take contol over their lives again. and to stop BIG GOVT from takin everything away from the people !  Not only does John Linderman want this , but also many Democrats and other Republicans. But what is so disturbing is that most people do not understand how it would work (as it has worked before… back before the war ) , but they refuse to believe it !!  Does the average person know how much they make ?  Or do they know how much they take home ?  Govt got greedy with the temporary tax withholdings and they decided to keep on doing that !  And it has been a down hill roller coaster ever since !  And if we really want to get into blaming someone ......we should blame the people who allowed our govt to continue on with this !!  There has been so much happening for years with our govt, and they have hoped that we would not notice. It has been a slow and sneaky process ....insice our school systems , our colleges , our TV programs, our corrupt media who are owned by the govt…..etc.  I remember my mother saying to me in the late 1950’s , that the communists will over come ......and they will do it any which way that they can and one way is by TV progaming.  Inside the school system during the past 30 years, we have had kids coming in being totally unrespectful of their teachers with sacrastic remarks and no teacher is allowed to say much to them , because if you do , you have a parent at the door upset that you hurt the child’s feelings !  Well, I am sick of this !
What people have been taught in schools and through the media and through TV shows has helped to bring this country to it’s knees !!!  As I said, it has been a slow and sneaky process that has been going on for many years , in hopes that no one would notice or pay any attention.  And it is still going on .....and THEIR BIG PLAN is to bury us !!  And the elderly in this country are going to have to their civic duty at the age of 60 and go for counseling because they cost the govt too much money , and forget about being grandparents.  And the younger and stronger generation will be working for the govt and making the same living so that everything will be fair .......while the fat cats in Washington will be living like the ROMANS did , at least for awhile.
That is how I see things right now.  And if anyone in here wants to say or prove otherwise, well ......I am ready to read or to listen to whatever you disgree with , because believe me , I WANT TO BE WRONG in my way of thinking, and from my observations through life.  Seriously !  I work with many elderly people now who are feeling so sorry that they voted for Obama.  Everyone is scared !!  Is that anyway for anyone to be feeling about their government ?  They all believe they will be going for counseling soon getting help to do their civic duty and to end their lives !!  HOW SAD IS THAT ??  I don’t have to wonder what has happened to this country. I have been watching it happen for years !!!  SO WHAT NEXT ??  WHAT DO WE DO ??  I may never be back here in this medium . I might be volunteering for Palin, besides working to help others who need my help. I am lucky so far and can afford to do so.  I am so fed up with people who want to keep trusting BIG GOVERNMENT and who need a NANNY !  I wish people would just GROW UP and stop depending on corrupt govt to take care of them and to make decisions for them !  Oh, I understand they have some nice parks and well lit areas with some nice park benches while we are all waiting in line to see a the doctor that they have chosen for us !  How considerate of them !! And when we all argue in here .....at least we still have that freedom, but bottom line is that I think we all want the same thing ......to defend our constitutional rights , but it is really hard to post things….....what you mean and well, it’s not like sitting around the table face to face and having a normal discussion.  It is hard here, but I am doing the best that I can , as I know everyone is !  GOD BLESS US ALL!

Diane,

You know it has become bad when the Russian Newspaper, Pravda is more accurate and more truth exposed more corruption in this once Great country than our own Media. I have lived the American Dream, it has left us out in the cold now. There was a time when Bush was a very good President, until his last year in office, I truly believe the constant pounding he took from the Media eventually got to him and hurt his family. But there is no doubt his first 7 years were good. The economy began its downfall after the democrats took over both Houses in 2006.

But being pounded on the war in Iraq, is something the democrats were VERY instrumental in our going to war there in the first place. There were 87% of Congressional Democrats voted for the war and almost all of the Senate voted for the war, all based on the very same intelligence Bush had from our own people and the British, including much of the EU. WMDs were found, just not nuclear but banned Sarine an VX Gas which if enough is released into the atmosphere could be deadly to hundreds of Millions per drop. Our military found literally thousands of tons of these gas containers. Not to mention Saddam Hussein killed over 400,000 of his own people just to test the gas, much worse that the Serbian Genocide Clinton sent our troops into. Contrary to the media reports, they found hundreds of Al Qaeda training camps in Iraq.

Osama bin Laden was responsible for the first WTC bombing in the underground parking in the South Tower, and the bombing of the two U.S. Embassies in Africa (all under Clinton’s watch), bin Laden was captured in Jordan, being our ally, they offered him up to President Clinton…Clinton denied having him sent to the US. He could have prevented the Twin Tower incident had he taken him. Yet Billy Boy never offered an explanation as to why he would not accept bin Laden, furthermore, the press just barely reported the story.

When democrats took control of both the Senate and Congress, is when spending began to get out of hand, to get funding for the Troops, body armour, heavily armoured vehicles which could withstand the IED blasts, he had to capitulate to democrat spending they attached to his Bills for the War.

Bush’s other spending were for programs such as “No Child Left Behind” which after the first four years alone moved our international ranking in school scores up more than expected. School vouchers also played a role in getting failing students into private schools where their grade soared, even Obama took advantage of the program for his own children. Another program was creating surpluses in Medicare, and Social Security, which was almost empty when he took office. Under the Bush Tax Cuts we were able to pay for our Home by making payment on the back side of our loan, both my wife and I were able to put quite a bit of money into savings, contributed the maximum into our individual 401Ks, IRAs, Treasury Bonds, and played the Market well, and got out just in time, we sold 80% of our stocks in late 2006…nice returns.

Then Bush did the Bail-outs, which had a very negative impact on both Democrats and Republicans, all due to sub-prime mortgages for the poor. My Credit score is 840 (as high as it gets) my Wife’s was at 830, due to one late payment, and we still had to go through more than we should have to buy our home, even though at the time could have paid cash, but would have hurt our retirement. Yet, other less fortunate people with credit scores of under 350 were getting Mortgages easier than what we went through, thanks to organizations such as ACORN.

So when you hear Obama complain about how bad Bush left him economically, was actually a democrat program of sub-prime lenders. One thing Bush can NEVER be disputed, when he said he was going to do something, you could bet your butt it would be done. When he got the law passed to wiretap international phone calls is what stopped the airplane targeting the tower in L.A. and other proposed Al Qaeda attacks, but for that bill to pass, democrats had to sign on, but they attached massive spending for him to protect our country better with better Intel.

Bush not only gave EVERY American a real meaningful tax cuts, he also repealed by executive order, the Death Tax, the Marriage Penalty, the Inheritance Tax, made the Tax Brackets wider and more fair, for five years had one of the best economies we have ever had, Stock Market records which we may never see again. He tried to stop Eliminate Domain, but was filibustered, then when democrats took control over both Houses, it was easily passed.

If Bush was in any way in support of any sort of Socialism, I would like to see that in writing from his own words, that is one thing which is just not in his DNA. The biggest disappointment of all, was the out of control spending by Republican in the House and Senate, and the Bail-outs, he requested and receive $700 Billion, but spent only $350 Billion, that was done based on what the Fed Chairman said was needed to stabilize the economy. Because of that $700 Billion (which 100% of democrats voted for that Bail out package, Bush left Obama a $1.2 Trillion deficit. The only good thing that that came from the Mid-term elections which put democrats in control of Both Houses, is it got rid of the Spending Republicans.

Obama has already set spending records in the first six months, Bush was there for eight years even after inheriting a $900 Billion deficit from Clinton.

People should have woke up when Obama stumbled across “Joe the Plumber” and he asked Obama if he would be helping Small Businesses as Bush did, that he wanted to start his own Plumber Business. That is when the media caught Obama stating that he believed in “Spreading the Wealth”, a code name for Socialism. 

One thing which is really hurting Obama is he is still blaming Bush for the economy. Much of which came from democratic pork spending. Presidential historians and Economists regardless of party all agree, once a new president takes office, and begins his/her own recovery packages, the Economy then belongs to Obama, no excuses. He [Obama] did another bail out, and a $787 Billion plus the $350 Billion Bush never spent.

Reagan never complained about the huge deficit Carter left, just as Bush never complained about the recession Clinton left him.

On the news the played all of Obama’s Campaign promises regarding Health Care Reform, there was NOTHING he is doing now, compared to what he promised. One of the many reasons his approval rating is below 50% from 85% at the beginning, although the media (other than Fox and Lou Dobbs of CNN which may get him fired).

Obama is now blaming the Republicans for the failure to pass his Health Care plans. Yet democrats hold a majority in Both Houses and a Super Majority at that…so someone please tell me how it is the Republicans fault? The last vote count in Congress had 103 democrats voting NO.

The latest Rasmussen Poll reports on Obama’s Performance, this one based on only on Strongly Approve, and Strongly Disapprove is:

Strongly Approve:  29%
Strongly Disapprove: 40%

Then there is this

“According to published reports, Barack Obama’s legal team has been paid over one million dollars, so far, to STOP anyone from seeing ANY of his actual identification documents, or many other documents:
•  Actual long-form birth certificate (NOT an easily-forged electronic copy of a short-form document that is not even officially accepted in Hawaii)
•  Passport files
•  University of Chicago Law School scholarly articles
•  Harvard Law Review articles
•  Harvard Law School records
•  Columbia University records
•  Columbia University senior thesis, “Soviet Nuclear Disarmament”
•  Occidental College records, including financial aid that he may have received
•  Punahou School records, where Mr. Obama attended from the fifth grade until he finished high school
•  Noelani Elementary School records, where Barack Obama attended kindergarten (according to the Hawaii Department of Education, students must submit a birth certificate to register—but parents may bring a passport or student visa if the child is from a foreign country)
•  Complete files and schedules of his years as an Illinois state senator from 1997 to 2004
•  Obama’s client list from during his time in private practice with the Chicago law firm of Davis, Miner, Barnhill and Gallard
•  Illinois State Bar Association records
•  Baptism records
•  Obama/Dunham marriage license
•  Obama/Dunham divorce documents
•  Soetoro/Dunham marriage license
•  Soetero/Dunham Adoption records
By the way, the issue of the Occidental College records is especially pertinent. The United States Justice Foundation (USJF) served officials at Occidental College with a subpoena to produce records concerning Barack Obama’s attendance there during the 1980’s, because those records could document whether he was attending as a foreign national. You see, Mr. Obama attended the school on a scholarship—and there are questions as to whether the financial aid he received was reserved for foreign students. The Obama attorneys have bent over backward to block us. He doesn’t want anyone to see those records. He’s STILL trying to hide them; those financial records STILL have not been released.

WHAT is Barack Obama trying to hide? WHAT is he afraid of? WHY doesn’t he just release these documents to prove that he is a natural-born citizen and, therefore, qualified to serve as President—especially his actual birth certificate?

Frankly, the evidence that Barack Hussein Obama was born in Africa—not Hawaii as he claims—and, therefore, cannot serve as the President of the United States, is compelling.
•  First, Mr. Obama’s refusal to release his birth certificate. If he has nothing to hide, what does he gain by refusing to allow the press to see the birth certificate?
•  Second, the contention by Barack Obama’s half-sister, Maya Soetoro-Ng, that Mr. Obama was born in a particular Hawaiian hospital, only to claim that it was in a different hospital several years later. And, most recently, Barack Hussein Obama has contradicted himself, in writing, regarding the name of the hospital where he claims to have been born.
•  Third, the erecting of a wall around Barack Obama’s grandmother, the late Madelyn Dunham, by Mr. Obama, thus cutting off access to the one person then alive who would have been present if he was actually born in Hawaii.
•  Fourth, the posting of law enforcement personnel at the two hospitals in Honolulu mentioned by Ms. Soetoro-Ng in an effort to block the press from discovering the truth about the birth certificate.
•  Fifth, a taped phone conversation with Mr. Obama’s step-grandmother in Kenya, who claims that she was present at his birth… in what is now called Kenya!
•  Sixth, the “birth certificate” posted on the Obama campaign website and other liberal websites. Since Barack Obama was born in 1961, long before laser printers and office computers, his original birth certificate would be typewritten ... unlike the laser printed “copy” purported to be genuine.”

Re: Post 91;

You post far too much hot air here for anyone to respond to all of it.  But - here’s a simple (and irrelevant) sample of how you repeat false information:

“... This time, his next door neighbor saw him using his shoulder to open the rear door to the home ...”

Regarding the 9-1-1 call to the police indicating the caller thought someone might be trying to break into a home (Gates’ home) - if it was “his next door neighbor” - don’t you think the neighbor would have RECOGNIZED Gates?

IN FACT, the call was make by a passer-by who actually worked SEVERAL homes away from Gates home as a housekeeper - reporting that she thought someone was trying to break-in through Gates’ FRONT door.

In this case, the distinction (and your comment) is irrelevant.  BUT - it shows how you indiscriminately pick up unsubstantiated/uncorroborated info from your favorite far right-wing websites - and then you post it here as “fact” - an action not unlike your never-ending complaints about how the mainstream media operate.

Post 99:

I reported what was reported on what CNN reported on…They were wrong, were they not? I later heard the call on Fox News and it correctly stated the front door. It doesn’t matter in this instance, now does it??

The Basic Fact is what you need to remember, the door jammed, it took two people who she could not see, called 9-1-1. He should have been arrested for his hostile behavior to the police when called to a burglary in progress, since the Home had been broken into recently, and was trying to protect him or his valuables. Next time, perhaps the police will be more astute and just say to themselves, never-mind…we are going to be baited.

Yes, I know they would have to go if called, but instead of being there in less than 4 minutes, it could take half an hour.

Had that happened to me, I would have run to the entryway with my gun in my hand. If I saw it was the police, I would drop the gun immediately, kick it away from me, and put my hands behind my head and kneel.

It was the Professor’s obstinacy and hate speech that got him into trouble, as he should have been. He has admitted he lied when was the owner of the Home, He rents it from Harvard. He first refused to show his driver’s license when asked, and kept throwing racial slurs and the police. I sincerely wish he had filed a law suit against the department, if only to embarrass him to the world.

Even if the Black Mayor during today’s news conference with the police commissioner and Solicitor General about this ordeal…Sgt. Crowley did not appear, all saying how unfortunate this was, and if he (the Professor) had been calm, nothing would have become of this, except them Obama would have to admit his own Racism when he commented on it during a presser in Prime Time, saying that the Cambridge Police acted stupidly, before he knew ANTHING about what happened, and had to apologize.

After being treated the way Sgt. Crowley was treated, I would NOT join him and the dumb-ass at the White House for a beer (and not only because I do not drink alcohol at all). It would be the principle of the matter, and to get Obama out of a Jam.

Re: Post 97;

Your paragraph:

“... You know it has become bad when the Russian Newspaper, Pravda is more accurate and more truth exposed more corruption in this once Great country than our own Media. I have lived the American Dream, it has left us out in the cold now. There was a time when Bush was a very good President, until his last year in office, I truly believe the constant pounding he took from the Media eventually got to him and hurt his family. But there is no doubt his first 7 years were good. The economy began its downfall after the democrats took over both Houses in 2006…”

Now, where did you pick up the line “Pravda is more accurate than the media in this country”?  By the way, do you read Russian and are you as factually up-to-date on domestic Russian affairs as you claim to be on U.S. domestic affairs?

The whole comment is nutty - but the Bush comment is particularly nutty: “... But there is no doubt his first 7 years were good ...”  Where do you get off with the “no doubt”?  Not even all Texans would buy that outlandish statement.

And talk about purely partisan nitwitism: “... The economy began its downfall after the democrats took over both Houses in 2006…”

The economy began its downfall with the economic policies set in motion in the 1980s - and it was aided and abetted by the lack of regulation over various questionable operations on Wall Street, including blurring the line between banks and brokerages; allowing leverage to go from 15-1 to 40-1 and more; incentivizing (with tax breaks) corporations to move operations offshore; the development of exotic and unregulated derivitives’ and, of course, tax cuts while Reagan and Bush 43 exponentially expanded the size of government and the budget - and - Bush 43’s tax cuts coupled with his ridiculous $200+ billion per year adventure into Iraq.

You can be a parroting partisan if you want - but at least parrot stuff that isn’t totally absurd and/or ignorant-sounding!  Your last sentence in this paragraph is one of the more ridiculous things you’ve posted here.

This recession is the result of long-time-developing and complex failures in economic policies initiated and/or promulgated by Reagan, Bush 41, Clinton and Bush 43.

You want me to send you my book of parody prose? I only had fifty books printed and bounded, since so much of it was out of date, not to mention most of it is non political…ACE! hole.

It also contains many poems children have written in schools, each attributed to the child with parental consent. I have two copies left. There is even one I wrote about Mark Foley called “Tap Dance”.

Post 103:

I got my numbers from the World Almanac; their sources are from the Governmental History in the Library of Congress.

So much for your insistence about Bush’s multi Trillion deficit, as a large part of the previous years spending by the President were being paid back to the Government Coffers.

btw: Typing sentences in all caps shows either ignorance of the web, or yelling in anger. Your name calling is just pubescent childish behavior.

Diane (re: #95) - “I didn’t agree with McCain about everything and I didn’t think that he had the fire in his soul that it took to be our president .....but I did think that Palin had more on the ball that Obama or Biden.”

I sympathize with your political trepidations, Diane, and I know where you’re coming from.

However, don’t expect much relief should Palin win the presidency. A lewrockwell.com article, dated today, stated that she “looks to Bill Kristol, of all creeps, for political guidance.”
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/031118.html

Here’s a brief commentary about Kristol from and article “Neo-Chicanery” http://www.lewrockwell.com/decoster/decoster56.html -
[Bill Kristol, the Godfather of neo-chicanery, long ago disposed of limited government ideals in favor of bigger taxes, more environmental regulation, greater income redistribution, and the break-up of anti-government sentiment. For Kristol and cohorts like Bill Buckley, David Brooks, and Norman Podhoretz, the secular religion of the State has come to replace a decentralized Republic of limited government. No longer is limited government the goal; instead it is limiting the social left in positions in government, and inserting big-government Republicans in their place.
And statism, as we well know, is a special sweetheart of all the former leftists that gravitated from Leftist to Neocon status. First, they claim a love of the free market and a desire for less government intervention upon that realm. And they profess to want more individual autonomy for citizens, with less coercion from collective groups and federal bureaucrats. Yet, in spite of their declaration of favoring smaller government, they pile more of it upon us each time they are given the opportunity.]

If anyone thinks the Republicans are going to fly into town eventually to save us from Obama and the Democrats, read a little about some of their accomplishments here - Socialism, Republican-Style
http://www.lewrockwell.com/tennant/tennant34.html

And finally, if you want to view a history of the so-called party of ‘less government’, you’ll see that ‘less government’ was never in their genes, and never will be, by reading this - “Government Growth, the Party of Lincoln, and George W. Bush”
http://www.lewrockwell.com/gregory/gregory40.html

A disaster such as the Obama presidency didn’t just happen by some fluke. It was a rebuttal of GW Bush, just as the 2006 mid-term victory was a rebuttal against the Republican party and George Bush, just as the Republican victory in 1994 was a rebuttal of Bill Clinton.

Hope this helps.

Re: Post 105;

No.

And, I can see that you STILL have NOT LEARNED the difference between “deficit” and “national debt”.

As I’ve said, over eight years, Bush 43 has directly contributed some $6+ TRILLION to the NATIONAL DEBT.  His “deficits” each year were under $1 trillion - but his total contribution to the national debt was $6+ TRILLION - NOT COUNTING the estimated $2.5+ TRILLION that it will cost while getting out of Afghanistan and Iraq - and providing continuing health care and other benefits to military who served in those countries - to date, some 30,000 have been SERIOUSLY wounded or injured.

Try to get it this time.

Please.

Wesley - re: #108

The Lew Rockwell site is Libertarian, strong advocates of the Constitution, and rejects Liberalism as well as big-government Conservatism.

This site has never condoned attacks on Palin, and has pointed out the double-standard that Obama and his family enjoys over Palin and her family in regards to the ridicule and cowardly, vicious verbal assaults suffered by her from lowlifes like David Letterman.

Any criticism that I, or Libertarian sites may have of her are political in nature in that we worry that she may be corrupted by the RINO’s and Neocons that rule the Republican party these days.
Personally, I like her and admire her courage in regards to the unfair media coverage she’s been receiving. I haven’t written her off, however, hearing that she’s hanging around the likes of Bill Kristol makes me worry, should she eventually decide to run.

Wesley (#112) - “If given the chance, you will see a new Republican party, they are even running their own candidates against some of whom are now holding office.”

That would be great and would certainly give me some hope. However, even if Obama’s numbers continue to down slide as 2012 approaches, you still need a ‘somebody’ to defeat an incumbent in most cases. After all, the Republicans could never count on the MSM to prop up any of their candidates as a general election approaches, such as they did with Obama.
Personally, I felt that Hillary was a far more adept candidate than he, and can also speak. Would be interesting to know why the MSM turned on her for this guy. If one believes that we have a ‘shadow government’ running, or greatly influencing the political scene, such as the Trilaterals or Bilderburgers, perhaps they felt she was too much of a ‘loose cannon’ in her persona, and therefore, not as malleable as Obama. Who knows?

Re: Post 112;

You INSIST on your malarkey about the Reagan and Bush 43 contributions to the national debt.

If you’re such a “good researcher”, I can’t believe you can’t find historical data and annual budget deficits and contributions to the national debt by ANY or ALL presidents!

For the LAST time:

Reagan TRIPLED the national debt and doubled the size of government.

Bush 43 MORE THAN DOUBLED the national debt that existed on Clinton’s last day in office - while Bush did not have any single year where his bedgetary deficits topped $1 trillion - his TOTAL DEFICITS over his eight years totaled more than $6 TRILLION - and some $2.5 trillion additional can be attributed to him for the future cost of his Iraq and Afghanistan adventures - for military benefits for those who served in iraq and Afghanistan - and for long-term medical care cost for the 30,000+ thus far wounded or injured in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Your post is full of crap regarding Bush.  You either totally misrepresent - or when you find the correct information, you fail to comprehend and understand it sufficiently to re-post it here.

Bush 43 and Reagan are the historical #1 and #2 ranking contributors to the national debt.  Once again - Reagan contributed some nearly $3 trillion - and Bush 43 some $6+ trillion.  It is a joke for GOPs to believe these two were “fiscal conservatives” and “small government” proponents. 

(And, of course, Clinton had budgetary surpluses in four of his eight years - he actually made payments on the national debt - totally, his administration only contributed about $500 billion to the national debt - and he left a $300 billion cash budgetary surplus to Bush 43 - who squandered it.)

Re: Post 116;

Stick it up your arse, no mind!

Re: Post 118;

Leave it to you to use a French dialect term like “cretin” in a typically racist way.

Originally, the term refers to someone with a condition resulting in severely stunted physical and mental growth due to an untreated congenital condition arising from a deficiency of thyroid hormones - or from a nutritional deficiency of iodine.

The word was commonly used by the French in the 19th and 20th centuries as a derogatory or pejorative term in Alpine regions where such a medical condition was very common - and it was used in that dialect as an insulting term referring to the ostensibly “stupid behavior” on the parts of the victims of the medical condition described.  And, while the word’s original origin is debated - it is believed to be an abuse of the French word “Chretien” - which, in English, means “Christian” - or the Swiss word “Crestin”, also meaning “Christian”.

You apparently have shown your true self.

And, note: your comments attempting to justify why Reagan and Bush 43 are the most profligate presidents to date in U.S. history are, like with a lot of what you have to say, pure bulls**t. 

(And, don’t flatter yourself; I don’t think anyone would waste any “anger” on somebody like you.  “Pity”, maybe, but definitely not “anger”.  It’s apparent you really can’t help yourself.)

Post 115: TK,

Clinton refused to use CBO numbers, and had a private Accounting Firm which was not so independent, he was good an selling the Surplus, in fact he dipped into it so much in his last two years. The surplus did not count what needed to be put back into Social Security, from all he took out. It is virtually impossible to have a surplus and go into a recession with debt.

When you were bragging on the French Health Care system, what you didn’t mention, mainly due the fact you did not do ANY Research, such as the French Health Care posts a $15.7 Billion shortfall each year. The U.K. is losing $11.8 Billion, Canada is posting $11.2 loss in Health Care. One thing all these socialist Health Care Countries also do not mention are the extreme long lines to see a primary Doctor, and up to eight months to get a needed test, treatment takes even longer. The older one gets, beginning at the age of 60, their options are even less, when you reach 75, there are really no options. This is true for all Government Controlled Health Care.

Not to mention, Clinton closed countless Military bases, cut the Military Budget, closed down all operatives in foreign lands, and wasted years of our people blending and getting good Intel. This happened AFTER the first WTC Bombing, and the Oklahoma Murrow Building destroyed.

After Bush took office, he was in the process of rebuilding the Military Bases, many of which had to go to other locations. Then after the worst attack on US soil, with planes full of passengers flying into both WTC towers, the Pentagon, and the one the passengers took down was headed for the White House. And you do not think those terrorist were afraid of Bush? Of course they were, as was Kim Jong Il, who under Obama is just ignoring him, he laughs at Obama, Biden, and Clinton (who they called a woman who acted like a silly little girl.

Which only goes to show you are once again wrong.

A 1934 (April 24, 1934)A Cartoon pulled from The Chicago Tribune newspaper shows a Character of the President (FDR) writing his Recovery Plan, which reads:

1.  “Plan on Action for the U.S.” (Title) on the pad he is writing on…

Below that, he writes:

Spend! Spend! Spend!
Under the guise of Recovery—Bust the Government
Blame the Capitalists for the Failure-Then Junk the Constitution
And Declare a Dictatorship

Above where he is writing, you see a horse cart full of Congressmen piled with bags of money heading out of town.

In the background you can see written “It worked for Russia”
—————————-
Another one from the NYT:

Cartoon show the U.S. made with a wall around it, above is a huge cart, printed on the cart is, “Federal Reserve” there are six guys with shovels, the cart is full of money and IOU’s. The workers with the shovels are shoveling the money and IOU’s into the U.S.

Re: Post 121;

And, once again, another of your incoherent streams of consciousness filled with blarney.

This is apparently just another occasion for you to babbles random nothingnesses simply to promote your hatred of the political opposition.

For some time, for all reasons, experts in health care systems point to France as being emblematic of a very successful system - and France leads the U.S. in a wide variety of statistical measures of the efficacy of their effective systems.  If you want to disregard that reality - be my guest.

There’s no doubt that the COST of U.S. health care will soon break the bank.  Costs have doubled in the last dozen to fifteen years - and will double again in the next ten.  And, for many, that cost has already become self-rationing.  (80% of personal bankruptcies filed over the last few years are said to be the result of the inability to pay medical bills.)  “COST” (to the individual, the business, the insurance company or the government) is THE issue.  If you want to ignore that - or if you want to “hate” any measure proposed to reduce that cost - be my guest.

Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush are the two most profligate presidents in American history - adding TRILLIONS to the national debt of $800 billion that existed on Carter’s last day in office.  In Reagan’s case, most of his contribution to the debt was due to TAX DECREASES WITHOUT CONCOMITANT BUDGET DECREASES - i.e., cut taxes but continue to spend.  He also doubled the size of government - and pissed away a fortune in military expenditures that had not one iota of positive benefit to this date.  George W. Bush went the SAME route: TAX DECREASES WITHOUT CONCOMITANT BUDGET DECREASES - and he, too, pissed away trillions in an expansion of government (ever heard of the “Homeland Security Department”?) - and in a couple of seven-years-and-counting, ill-advised military adventures in Iraq and Afghanistan.  If you want to deny and ignore the facts - be my guest.

And, note: your ideological spiels are based on nothing more than your inability to recognize reality when you see it - or on your willful misstatements made in the interests of spreading paranoid propaganda.  But - be my guest.

Boy, when TK (Total Kook) gets going, he just hates to stop. Anyway, didn’t one of those EEEEEvil republicans cut a deal with congress to the effect of: for every dollar of tax cuts, congress would cut TWO dollars of spending? Did those democrat congresses stick to that deal? Obviously not.

Speaking of tax increases, didn’t Bush 41 lose out on a secord term for “Read my lips! No new taxes! The hockey Puck keeps harping on Reagan and Bush as big spenders, but did you ever see ONE liberal democrat fight against that spending????

Post 126:

Show me the research which shows the numbers you continue to put out there for Reagan and Bush, then compensate for why extra spending was needed to put back what was taken away.

————-I want proof now, or you have to drop the subject———-

I will say this, if I was held hostage with a whole group of Iranians, I sure as hell would not want Carter or Clinton in charge. Let me see, on what day were the Iranian Hostages freed?, Oh yeah, the day Regan was sworn into office, the flight was timed for the moment of the end of Reagan’s oath to Office.

Post 128:

“ignorant blind ideologues”...Nice, but typical from you.

FYI, I didn’t leave anything out, I simply pointed out what was meant when you were called a Cretin, I am sure it had noting to do with anything medical, do you not think so also…

Post 130:

You didn’t answer my first question, you deflected once again…

If during today’s Beer Summit, before I would take a drink, I would make sure there would be an apology from Barack, and the Racist Gates or just turn around and walk away.

People seem to have forgotten there were Black Policemen there as well, of whom backed up Sgt. Crowley (Yes I have listened to several of his speeches) and they are all hate filled, perhaps why he and Obama are friends, Gates too is a Fan of Reverend Wright.

I have more truly good Black friends, than you have White. For your information, they think Gates is a Racist, too.

Did you by any chance see Obama’s 14th Health Care Speech yesterday? Someone ask him about his “out of control spending”, he replied, (paraphrasing) “Well, remember, I inherited $1.3 Trillion from the previous Administration…”

That included the $700 Billion for bail-outs, $485 Billion for massive flooding in the Mid-West, and three Hurricanes, and $115 Billion for the war in two countries. Why is Obama not saying what he did with the other $350 Billion from TARP money he inherited from what Bush did not spend? So much for all your previous claims it was much, much more. Even Lou Dobbs on CNN is complaining about Obama spending 4x in six months than all Presidents before him!

For the record, your insults to me in most every reply do not bother me, it actually reflects on your character more than I.  <smilling>

As for “Cretin” why did YOU not mention there were two meanings, the blast me for using the primary definition?

Re: Post 131;

The Master Researcher “wants proof”?

(Do you have “proof” that “Obama is a Usurper”?)

If, on your own, you can’t quickly find multiple, MULTIPLE, online sources which provide annualized information on the accumulated national debt - or if you can’t find multiple online sources enumerating the additional national debt accumulated president-by-president - then you should be ashamed of yourself!

And, note:  There’s no point in me providing you with any source - because you’ll automatically jump into casting aspersions on the source - your (and othere here, too) usual partisan “attack the messenger” bit.

To repeat - BEFORE you start ragging on DEMs or Obama “spending” - REMEMBER - George W. Bush ADDED some $6+ trillion to the national debt - and estimates are that winding down his Iraq and Afghanistan adventures - and paying for the ongoing medical costs of the 30,000 wounded or injured - plus paying for the other relevent veterans’ benefits, e.g., education - will cost ANOTHER $2.5 to $3.0 TRILLION.  So - Mr. Compassionate Conservative Bush is ultimately responsible for ADDING UP TO $9+ TRILLION TO THE NATIONAL DEBT - and most of that provided NO benefit to the average American.

So - my point is that GOPs have NO BUSINESS ragging on DEMs, or Obama, for “spending”.

(Note: If one includes the FULL 2008 Bush “bailout” of $700 billion in Bush’s last FULL year in office, up through his last day on Jan. 20, 2009 - then Bush’s FULL 2008 deficit is some $1.3 TRILLION and his total direct overall contribution to the national debt, consequently, goes WELL OVER $6 trillion.)

You never show me any proof of your sources, whereas I have, therefore C.Roy is correct…moving on. You can continue to post, but no one will respond. You are on your own with all your Liberal Conspiracy Theories, this is going nowhere, much like your job.

See ya!

This is related to the economy.  I listened to G.Edward Griffin last evening who wrote the book called : The Creature from Jekyl Island (1994). It tells the story of how the Federal Reserve began forming in 1910. The Federal Reserve system was formed on Jekyl Island by 7 eletists in the banking system. Anyway, he talked for a long time last night about how the Fed Reserve has been a fraud, and about what is happening now and what their plans are for our futures.  And it is not a nice picture!  Perhaps we should all me more concerned about what is happening inside that organization now than looking back and blaming past presidents for our ecomonic woes.  Afterall, we are not going that way. I am much more concerned about what is happening right now and where we are headed, and how to prepare for days ahead.  It looks extremely scarey. Griffin was saying last night (on the radio),  that it won’t matter much who the President is in the future, just as it hasn’t mattered too much in the past;  unless the citizens of America are able to abolish The Federal Reserve. (HR12-Bill, I think), as the Federal Reserve has been a SCAM.  I am hoping that AIM will open up an area regarding this topic, unless they already did once ; and I missed that. (???) Anyway….
he mentioned two helpful websites last night which I haven’t had time to check:  RealityZone.com (and he mentioned clicking on Unfiltered News)  He also mentioned :  Freedom Force International.Org.  (Just in case anyone might want to check those.) Will be interested to read your opinions regarding all of this. Sounded to me like that is where major problems have stemmed from for many years, and that we would have been better off without that organization. They are the ones who are taking us to a One World Order….a one world banking system, and a Tolitarian style of govt. 

And regarding the Gates issue : Obama didn’t want to speak up and say anything or get involved when the Iranian students were protesting that their election was not fair , and then fighting for their rights /lives in the streets !  And yet, HE certainly had NO trouble whatsoever speaking out and jumping to judgement (without knowing the facts) when he first learned that Gates had been arrested by the police.

Diane, you I will talk to…

Greenspan did a fairly decent job, but Bernanke is doing a horrible job, and is under investigation. However our current President does have something to do with both the Federal Reserve and Globalization. You also have to wonder why Obama has disallowed anyone to look at the books and look into the Fed.

If one were to view the Federal Reserve, you will find large payments to the United Nations and the IMF (International Monetary Fund). I have warned everyone recently about watching Goldman Sachs.

As a Goldman Sachs lobbyist, Mark Patterson once worked against a bill to curb executive compensation. The legislation’s sponsor: Barack Obama. They have allowed Goldman Sachs to buy out AIG and other Banks and Mortgage Companies. This is where Tax Cheat Timothy Geithner becomes involved.

On Wednesday March 18, 2009, Obama responding to the rising rage over the $165 million or so in bonuses paid to executives at the bailed-out insurance firm, Obama noted that he was quickly developing policies to prevent future AIG-like catastrophes. And he slammed Wall Street’s culture of “excess greed, excess compensation, excess risk taking.” To demonstrate that he’s committed to battling such greed, the president cited his work in the Senate to rein in executive compensation. Noting that he and Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.) had each introduced legislation on this front in 2007, Obama declared that “there were some people who attacked us, saying government has no business doing that.”

One of Obama’s opponents at that time was Mark Patterson, a lobbyist then for Goldman Sachs, the investment banking firm, which opposed the Frank-Obama initiative. Yet Patterson is now chief of staff to Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner, the embattled point man in the Obama administration’s endeavor to undo the notorious AIG bonuses. That is, a Washington influence-peddler who worked against Obama’s effort to limit excessive corporate pay is now a key member of the Obama administration team that is supposed to contain excessive compensation in the AIG case and in general.

More info on the IMF and the USA here:

http://www.imf.org/external/country/usa/index.htm

Obama has clearly stated he wants the U.N. involved in the U.S. in a one world government. He has donated $800 Million to the U.N. To make it easier, he wants one North America to start with, by combining the US with Canada and Mexico, which would make us easier to integrate with the One World Economy. Goldman Sachs stands to a have an important role in the Global Economy.

The U.N., and the IMF and Obama, would allow international laws to help Govern the US, much of all this can be tied back to the Federal Reserve spending that we are not allowed to see. By the US becoming Socialists opens the door to the U.N. imposing laws in the United States, if this is to be stopped, it will have to happen soon or we could stand to lose much of our sovereignty.

Re: Posts 139 and 140;

Hey, I thought you said you were running off with Claude?  What happened?  Did he trade you in for a less verbose model?

Your Post 139 is sure high-quality aimless and rambling!  Is there some point to it or are you just killing time?

You know, if you REALLY understood the idea of “The New World Order” and so-called globalization and internationalization - you’d understand that the issue is NOT “one-world government”.  The issue all along - since the 1880s (and maybe before) - with the Free Masons, the Illuminati, the Robber Barons, the Bilderburgs - and whomever else you want to throw into the mix - is about developing and building a ONE-WORLD ECONOMY!

The mooks with all the money don’t give one damn about the “government” - ours or anyone else’s - as long as any and all governments are laissez-faire and hands-off “the financial world”.  And, of course, Reagan, Bush 41, Clinton and Bush 43 have played along - and there’s no reason to believe that Obama won’t keep the trend going.

It’s all about the money, honey.

Political philosophies and style of government are irrelevant.

And note that Communist China is probably the biggest player in this so-called “capitalist” endeavor.

It’s all about the money.

Re: Post 140;

“... I have asked TK no less than eight times to show proof of his claims on the Bush Numbers ...”

You’re often such a whiney crybaby and sympathy-seeker!

(HAVE YOU EVER RESPONDED to a SINGLE question or opposite point of view that I HAVE POSED TO YOU?  No.  Not once.  Never.)

You know, every time you use that “show proof” dodge regarding the national debt - you actually show your ignorance of the workings of the U.S. government - yet - you continue to claim to be an “experienced researcher” and an “informed commentator” on U.S. government affairs, processes and politics.

I would guess that we might be somewhere around the same age - and should probably have had similar elementary school subjects and classes - including something called “citizenship” or “civics” or “government” or “current events” or some such.  And, I can tell you that it was in the third or fourth grade - I think most likely the third (a long time ago!) - that I first learned where to get information on the U.S. national debt.

If you can’t find corroboration of the Bush 43 administration’s $6+ trillion contribution to the current $11+ trillion debt - then you are neither informed in U.S. government nor any kind of a researcher.

On the other hand - you may know full-well where to look and be fully informed on the fact that Bush 43 was the most profligate president in U.S. history - but like you do with most of the other malarkey you post here - you’re just stonewalling and refusing to acknowledge the actual truth.

Bush 43 added $6 trillion to the national debt.

Further, this $6 trillion does not take into account the costs of winding down Iraq and Afghanistan; providing medical benefits to 30,000+ wounded and injured; and providing other related military benefits under the G.I. Bill.  These latter three items are most often estimated to cost an additional $2.5 trillion to as much as $3 trillion - making Bush 43 responsible for a final total addition to the national debt in the range of $8.5 to $9+ trillion.

Keep right on dodgin’!

Diane - re: post #137

Since you touched on the topic of the Federal Reserve, you might be interested in reading this essay from Austrian economist Murray Rothbard.
http://mises.org/books/whathasgovernmentdone.pdf

He illustrates in terms that the average person can understand, how commodity money (gold or silver) had been replaced by gold-backed paper money, which allowed for a somewhat excessive amount of inflationary debasement to occur, and finally to the disastrous fiat monetary system we’ve had since Nixon closed the ‘gold window’ in 1971. This has allowed the government to bring us ever closer to financial ruin, via unnecessary business cycles, recessions, depressions, reduced purchasing power for the average citizen, bailouts of incompetent, government connected corporations and banks, and a massive centralized government monstrosity, to name a few examples.

All of this could not have occurred without a central back (The Fed) and the shameful adherence, by both major parties, to an economic system that was devised by a British Socialist, John Maynard Keynes. (Keynesian economics)
In fact, I think this scoundrel has been reincarnated in the form of the guy with the wolf-like devious glint in this eyes, ‘economist’ Paul Krugman.

A quote from Mayer Rothschild during the 19th century - “Give me control of a nation’s money and I care not who makes it’s laws”

Sorry. I think I posted the wrong website above. Although there might be something on there from Gerald Calente.  There is also this one:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nJ7LM3iyNg

As I said, I imagine that you guys are way ahead of me and have already seen and heard all of this, and more.

Take care.

...and on, and on, and on…

PS. I remember seeing (but not reading) an article a long time ago about how many Americans were retiring in Europe. But I don’t remember the reasons why.  I wonder if those people are feeling any safer by now ?

Under the NEA (National Endowment of the Arts) has been funded by the Administration to the tune of $80 Million USD to fund sexually themed so-called Art, this includes films which are considered Pornographic, up to and including bestiality, 16 year old nude boys, “Kinky Porn Horror Art”, allowed under the guise of “Protected Freedom of Expression” (Includes Four men Three Women, and a Gorilla) for the NEA.

On the War in Afghanistan, many Democrats were outraged over Obama sending an additional 17,000 more troops there less than two months ago. Now he is planning another 20,000 troops to deploy in a few weeks. So, where is the Media Outrage, they ragged on Bush about by sending an extra 3,000 troops for the surge in the Anbar Province. Liberals said would never work and only cause more US deaths, yet it did work.

Let’s not forget, the Taliban did not blow up our Embassies, and did not participate in 9/11, in fact they have yet to find any Al Qaeda in Afghanistan, they are supposedly in Iran and other Terrorists Nations.
———————
Obama Administration Considers Zero Funding Agency Charged With Curbing Union Boss Corruption

Showing an uncharacteristic desire for a modicum of “fiscal discipline,” the Obama Administration is considering axing the Employment Standards Administration of the U.S. Department of Labor (DOL).

How convenient.

This division is the only part of DOL that actually investigates union officials and their rampant corruption, instead of bossing around job providers across America.

Empowered with forced unionism privileges eliminating virtually all accountability to rank-and-file employees, the Big Labor hierarchy has descended into a cesspool of corruption and cronyism.  Not surprisingly, the vast majority of the National Right to Work Legal Defense Foundation’s over 200 cases for thousands of employees deal with some form of union corruption.

Unions are nothing short of a blight on all Americans, and part of the reason of the collapse of the auto industry, especially during the Government bailouts of the industry, bought private shares of the companies (GM and Chrysler) converted the shares to Common Shares to take ownership in those companies, and gave the UAW a chunk of ownership in GM and Chrysler.

To boost sales of the New GM, the government, one of the idiot czars came up with the idea of Cash for Clunkers program, where they offer between $3,500.00 to $4,500.00 to trade in your gas guzzler, with the amount above taken off the price of a new GM car. The government allocated $1 Billion dollars for a four month program, it lasted Four Days. Now he wants to give the program another $2 Billion to the program, since the dealers are now stuck with the money given out, and the program is empty. That IS taxpayer money.

Remember Obama during and after the Campaign he promised the middle class for those making under $250,000 dollars per year, “NOT ON PENNY of taxes will be increased on the Middle Class, YOU CAN TAKE THAT TO THE BANK”. Well, it now appears that YES you will pay extra taxes after all, with Geithner telling a Sunday News show with George Stephanopoulos, that the “Government miscalculated and the Government now needs the money”. Obama maintained that promise after being elected, and up to June. The main reason for the change of mind is due to massive spending, including ObamaCare. So how will Obama blame Bush for the failure of Cash for Clunkers, how are they expected to run the Government?

So, why will Obama not allow anyone to see the books in the Federal Reserve, where an estimated $5 Trillion Dollars seem to have vanished?

Re: Post 152;

Your statement:

“... What is happening in Europe is, so many American Businesses have moved there, and many very wealthy people, they are now moving to the Right, as they now see what we cherished, it has already had an impact with lower taxes there…”

What unmitigated BALDERDASH!

Do misrepresent reality on purpose - or as a result of your failure to understand reality yourself - or what!

Americans have been retiring to other countries (including some in Europe) for the last 40 years or more BECAUSE (1.) they find the cost of living elsewhere to be significantly lower than in the U.S.; and/or (2.) they wish to retire to the country of their ethnic/cultural heritage.

Many different countries have been “in” with retirees over the years - recently, five to ten years ago, it was Costa Rica - today, it’s Panama.  Former Russian-controlled countries in Eastern Europe, like Poland, became popular after the fall of the USSR.

You’re just a petty propagandist.

Wesley, Regarding your most recent postings, I find that I am in total and absolute agreement with you !  I read everything line by line several times; and I have found that everything else which I am reading and have been hearing in recent days is in agreement with you also, (with the exception of tk, ofcourse and the MSM)

I also wish to add that I listened to Bob Chapman (International forecaster) the other night on the radio. The radio host said that Chapman was in an undislosed location because he had much information about Goldman Sacs, which he is not supposed to know. Hopefully, he will be sharing what he has been learning with us soon.  They also discussed the missing money from the Federal Reserve.  And they also touched on the subject of the those bonds which were found on two Japanese men crossing the Swiss border not too long ago. (Did you happen to hear about that ?)  I thought that I heard Chapman and a caller discussing that the amounts of money missing from the Fed Reserve, and the amount of the bonds which were discovered were the same ??  And then he added this question : “Coincidence? Makes one wonder.”  He also added that he has not heard another word regarding those bonds, and what has happened to them, and that remains a big secret.  He added that there is going to be an uprising sometime this Fall and that American people are going to be demanding the truth from govt.       
   
I also heard today that the Cash for Clunkers program is being used as a way for govt to gain access into people’s private computers. Very scarey !  So people are now warning each other not to open up that particular govt website on their computers. Once again, those evil Czars at work ! 
   
Thanks once again Wes, for all of the interesting, helpful and useful information and for taking the time to share all that you have learned.  And once again, it’s greatly appreciated !   

Take good care.

Hi Diane,

Just a I noted in post 142, thus ignoring post 141…Have kept my word to only speak to the truth and not reply to Liberals disguising themselves as Independents, when they are following the Liberal talking points.

About the T-Bills smuggled by the Japanese men found on the Italian Customs, it is odd that no one seems to know what happened to them, last I heard, the US Government were sending authorities to verify if they were real or not. But since then, there has not been a word.

When I mentioned I do research on what I have found out, is not limited to the Internet, news shows, magazines and such, there are some days a certain someone allows me access to LexisNexis, the worlds largest database on legal, risk management, corporate, government, law enforcement, accounting academic, news, politics. If you are searching for someone or something, everything that has ever been reported and verified, it even includes videos…if it is out there, it can be found on NexisLexis. Not to mention it contains the Library of Congress. You can search for a name, if it has ever been documented, it is on there, even if what you are looking for is international. Only Corporations, qualified Governments and the Very rich can afford it, even then you must provide reasons for use of the database, those who apply are vetted before access is given.

There was still no information on the T-Bills to be found, only thing mentioned after what the News reported, everything after that is marked “Classified”. However I am not allowed to print anything I read, a print function is limited.

Back to Corruption in the controlling liberal / Marxist Government is just so unbelievable, it causes conspiracy theories, which in some instances is intentional, to make those seeking the truth look like nutcases, but it is beginning to backfire, since real investigators find more and more leaked information. Obama has vowed if he finds those who are leaking information, he will use all means at his hands to to silence or discredit them.

I am sure you have heard about the overspending Republicans in Congress and the Senate, they are now gone, in the 2006 elections, the RNC would not back up those who were chronic spenders, they knew the only way to get Republicans back in office was to return to the fiscally responsible conservatives in office. In many instances they intentionally helped to defeat their own as a sacrifice for a better tomorrow, no doubt you have ever heard that by the MSM.

Most of Congress has already left for their August break, many of those up for Mid-Term elections in 2010, Democrats are hitting the campaign trail, the Democratic crowds are pretty damn large, but not good for the candidates since all the people are only interrupting them wanting to know why they are supporting ObamaCare, Fox News has been showing clips all day of these campaign stops and there are literally hammering them at every chance. The Senate will not break for break until this Friday, giving them one more chance to vote on the Health Care Bill, which the Blue Dog Conservative Democrats who were holding up that Bill, were taken into private meetings to make them change their minds. According to one Blue Dog Democrat who is not running for office next year, has told the media that they would make sure they would not be re-elected if they did not change their votes…most did, so it passed Congress at the very last minute. I am sure this is also a threat to the Democrat Senate.

As you have seen for yourself, there are those who dispute everyone else here have stooped to false information, telling untruths, and as is typical of these deniers will only mock you, and call you names for the telling the truth, perhaps some do not want to face the truth.

Tk (Is that short for Trike?) 

Thanks for the laughter !  <LOL>  It has become so apparant to me that you are so envious and jealous of the guys who post here with their knoweledge and research and references.  And the truth which others learn here hurts you, because you would rather people listen to your feelings and the garbage that you have learned from the MSM.  Even I asked you quite some time ago for a reference regarding something that you posted and you did not respond. And I was talking to you directly. But now that I am talking to Wesley, you are butting in like some big school yard bully !  But you have no power here among us with above average intelligence. Several of the guys who have posted here have been so right about you all along, and I got your number now too, youngster !  <LOL>  Go watch Chris Matthews.

Wes….Thanks also for the info regarding those energy saving light bulbs. Have already passed that valubable information along to others who had no clue.  I actually broke one last year and had no idea they were dangerous.

Wes .....I read more about the problem with AARP today which you mentioned. You were so right,and I have also cancelled my membership. It’s a shame what they are doing. 

Also saw the report on the Communist Czar that you mentioned. Seems he is responsible for starting the Apollo organization. And after learning more about that, if we were not concerned before; well, we have every reason to be worried about where this country is heading now!  (Cash for Clunkers program was brought up during this discussion inside this program.)

There was also more discussion on the radio today regarding privacy issues of the computers being used for the Cash for Clunkers program.  It was my understanding that there was a warning sign on that Govt website informing people that once they clicked on it, (whether the car dealers were using computers at work , or at home, or where ever); that the computer which the salesman were using to type in the information of the person who was trading in their old clunker and purchasing a new car, would become the property of the GOVT, as well as all information stored inside those computers.  Since FOX brought this to light, the govt has since removed that terms of agreement from that website.  Perhaps there was a misundestanding in the wording of the terms of agreement ??? Anyway, it was good they brought that to light, I think.